November 2021 - tlhIngan-Hol

Klingon Word of the Day: nompuq
by James Landau 11 Nov '21

11 Nov '21

>From: "De'vID" <de.vid.jonpin(a)gmail.com> >Subject: Re: [tlhIngan Hol] Klingon Word of the Day: nompuq>>> Klingon Word of the Day for Monday, October 18, 2021 >> >> Klingon word: nompuq >> Part of speech: noun >> Definition: authority, evidence, attestation, reference, citation >> Source: KLI Mailing list >> > >Pun: Wikipedia (wiki = {nom}, pedia = {puq}) There's another Wikipedia pun in the Klingon language. The word for bias is *jInbo'*, because "systemic bias", as they call it there, is a huge issue at Wikipedia.

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bong SeDwI' DopDaq puH-DujwIj neSlo' Qaw'lu'
by Will Martin 11 Nov '21

11 Nov '21

qaStaHvIS HeghwI’ ram bong SeDwI' DopDaq puH-DujwIj neSlo' Qaw’lu’. wanI’ legh jIlwI’. choghvatDajDaq ba’. chuSmo’, mer. DujwIj juS, ‘ach tlhoy Summo', neSlo’ qIp ‘ej Qaw'. DujwIj tlhopDaq mev DujwI qIppu’bogh Duj’e’. batlh vang SeDwI’ ‘e’ pIH jIlwI’. ghaytan lojmItwIj ghoS ‘ej murI’ pagh DujwIjDaq rI’meH mIw QIjbogh nav’e' lan. ghobe’. Duj ‘elHa’ nuv puqpu’ je ‘ej qaStaHvIS wa’ rep <<tojmeH pagh chabHom SuqmeH>> leng. ghIq DujDaj chegh, ‘el ‘ej tlheD Duj. tlheDpa’, Duj nuD jIlwI’. nav QIn ghItlh jIlwI’. Duj Del: *to'yota’ *‘avalan chIS ‘oH. [61 VTAIL] perlu’. jaj veb, jIl nav vItu’. pervam vIyajchu’. HemmeH per ‘oH. chalDuj Del. 1961 *bIyche’ *bananSa’ *vIy tlhuQ ‘oHba’. waghchu’. mIpba’ nuvvam. ghan’Iq vIrI’ ‘ej [insurance] malja’ vIrI’. Our cars were insured by the same company. vaj vIje’nISbe’. DujwIj tI’lu’. jIQuch. pItlh charghwI’ ‘utlh (ghaH, ghaH, -Daj)

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{je} "too" with negative meanings on the second sentence
by mayqel qunen'oS 10 Nov '21

10 Nov '21

yaS luHoHpu', 'a be' luHoHpu'be' je they killed the officer, but they didn't kill the woman too Seemingly/apparently the English sentence sounds strange; but is there anything wrong with the Klingon one? Is there something wrong in using the {je} "too" this way? -- Dana'an https://sacredtextsinklingon.wordpress.com/ Ζεὺς ἦν, Ζεὺς ἐστίν, Ζεὺς ἔσσεται· ὦ μεγάλε Ζεῦ

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Re: [tlhIngan Hol] Klingon Word of the Day: romuluSngan
by luis.chaparro＠web.de 10 Nov '21

10 Nov '21

I wanted to ask something about that word, so this KWOTD is very opportune :-) Some days ago I discussed the phrase: *romuluSngan Sambogh 'ej HoHbogh nejwI'*. Shouldn't it have been *romuluS Sambogh 'ej HoHbogh nejwI'*? I've also found another canon example: *loSmaH romuluSngan SuvwI'pu' HoHta' qeng*, translated: *Kang killed 40 Romulan warriors*. Is there something I'm missing? Thank you!

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Klingon Word of the Day: pep
by Klingon Word of the Day 10 Nov '21

10 Nov '21

Klingon Word of the Day for Wednesday, November 10, 2021 Klingon word: pep Part of speech: verb Definition: raise Source: TKD (99 KE, 148 EK) This Klingon Word of the Day is brought to you by qurgh (qurgh(a)kli.org)

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Re: [tlhIngan Hol] {je} "too" with negative meanings on the second sentence
by Will Martin 10 Nov '21

10 Nov '21

I like the analysis here. It makes me wonder about related issues. In English, the conjunctions “and” and “but” have identical meaning in terms of grammar and cold logic: “I like you, but I don’t like your friend.” “I like you, and I don’t like your friend.” These are subjectively different, but logically identical. In both cases, I’m telling you two things. 1. I like you. 2. I don’t like your friend. The thing that “but” introduces is a heightened sense of contrast. In Klingon, the use of {je} as an adverbial (not as a noun conjunction) in canon suggests that it acts as a sort of context anchor to bind together two SEPARATE sentences, NOT connected with a conjunction. It suggests that the sentence with {je} is a kind of appendix to the first sentence. I finished the first sentence, but now, I realize there was something I wanted to add to it. Too late for a conjunction. I’ll create a new parallel sentence and add {je} so you know that it adds information to the previous sentence. Ignore the parallel parts. Pay attention to the new information. So, while the problem example was presented as “Is there a problem with {je} being used with a negative verb?”, there seems to be a second problem with conjoining the two sentences with {‘ach} and also putting {je} at the end. The {je} becomes redundant, which is why the natural suggestion is to omit it. So, what happens if you omit {‘ach} and make them two separate sentences? yaS luHoHpu’. be’ luHoHpu’be’ je. Then the problem becomes more obvious: They killed the officer. They also didn’t kill the woman. Now, it sounds obviously weird, because the sentences are not sufficiently parallel. SuStel made this point quite well. I’m just making it a little more obvious, and digging into a parallel issue. It’s interesting that {je} used this way to bind two grammatically separate sentences outside of grammatical construction parallels {‘ej}, which binds them grammatically. Meanwhile, we don’t have an outside-of-grammar linking word parallel to {‘ach}. I want a persimmon. I want whipped cream, too. I smelled the cupcake. I ate the cupcake, too. I liked the persimmon. I didn’t like the cupcake, however. In Klingon, the only word for “however” is {‘ach} and it’s a conjunction, not an adverbial. We don’t have an adverbial that offers that sense of contrast that you seem to be seeking. Now is it more obvious why the {je} in your example was redundant with the {‘ach} and why {‘ach} was the word to keep and {je} was the word to omit? That’s the nugget I was after when I started this. I just figured this out. Forgive the wandering to get to this point. > On Nov 10, 2021, at 9:07 AM, SuStel <sustel(a)trimboli.name> wrote: > > On 11/10/2021 7:50 AM, mayqel qunen'oS wrote: >> yaS luHoHpu', 'a be' luHoHpu'be' je >> they killed the officer, but they didn't kill the woman too >> >> Seemingly/apparently the English sentence sounds strange; but is there anything wrong with the Klingon one? Is there something wrong in using the {je} "too" this way? > Based on how je is presented in The Klingon Dictionary, I don't think this is how it works. It appears to be used when you want to change one element of the OVS part of a sentence and compare it to the previous sentence. > > SoHvaD 'uQ wej vIqem. > Dargh vIqem je. > Conversational Klingon. The changed element is the food brought. > > jIghung. > jIghung je. > > jI'oj. > jI'oj je. > Power Klingon. The changed element is the verb. > > 'ej ghIjpu' [tlhIngan may'Duj] > nIteb ghIjpu' je [tlhIngan wo' Degh] > Skybox SP1. The changed element is the thing doing the scaring. > > ghop luQan tajHommey. > pe'laH je. > Skybox SP2. The changed element is the verb. > > And so on. So I don't think you'd combine > > yaS luHoHpu' > and > 'a be' luHoHpu'be' je > > in this way. Here, you're changing both the object and the verb. > > Just say yaS luHoHpu' 'a be' luHoHpu'be' They killed the officer but they didn't kill the woman. The 'a but handles the unexpectedness of the woman not also being killed. If you wanted to emphasize the exception, you could say something like yaS luHoHpu' 'a yIntaHbe' 'e' luchaw' They killed the man but they permitted the woman to live. > > -- > SuStel > http://trimboli.name > _______________________________________________ > tlhIngan-Hol mailing list > tlhIngan-Hol(a)lists.kli.org > http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org

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grow and shrink
by Lieven L. Litaer 10 Nov '21

10 Nov '21

In Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, the main character Alice keeps growing and shrinking back and forth. For the Klingon translation of the work, Marc Okrand provided some interesting and useful information on how to say "grow". As usual, the answer is not very straightforward and makes things quite complicated. This text is printed in the book on page 234. It is archived in the Wiki http://klingon.wiki/En/Grow and on qepHom.de https://www.qephom.de/e/message_from_maltz_211104_grow.html <<<<< The word for "grow" (increase in size) is {Qa}. But for animals or plants growing, that is, maturing (not just increasing in size), use {nenchoH}. {QaHa'} would refer to getting smaller after the thing had previously grown bigger — that is, it's losing (in length or whatever) what it had gained. So if the balloon is losing air, you could say it {QaHa'}. Presumably the object is going back towards it's original size (though it may not get that far or may become even smaller than it once was). For "get smaller, shrink" (without the notion of having previously grown), use {qer}. Of course, depending on exactly what you want to say, you can also use {machchoH}. The choice depends on whether you're focusing on just the shrinking or growing, on the one hand, or on the return to or towards the original size (or beyond!). So if your main character started at their original size, and then shrank, that's {qer}. If they then started to grow, that would be {Qa} if the storyteller is just saying that they grew, but it would be {qerHa'} if the storyteller was saying that the shrinking was reversing. If the de-shrinking continued so that the character ended up bigger than they originally were, that might be {qerHa'} and then — what a surprise! — {Qa}. For Pinocchio, if you're saying that after his nose grew he started telling the truth and his nose got smaller, that's probably {QaHa'}. If you'd just met the long-nosed Pinocchio for the first time and didn't know the story of the nose but saw it get smaller, you'd probably say {qer}. In short, you have four words to choose from, depending on what exactly you want to say: {qer}, {qerHa'}, {Qa}, {QaHa'}. For "grow" as in "I grow flowers" or "she grows carrots," use {reS}. (Weird, right? Maltz wasn't sure if this revealed something about early Klingons' understanding of how plants grow or if it was just a coincidence.) And for "grow" as in "grow a mustache," make use of {nargh}, as in {nargh lochwIj} "I'm growing a mustache." (To indicate that you're doing it on purpose, you could say {nargh lochwIj 'e' vIchaw'} "I'm letting my mustache grow" or something similar.) >>>>> -- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" http://www.tlhInganHol.com http://klingon.wiki/En/AliceInWonderland

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Klingon Word of the Day: QIt
by Klingon Word of the Day 09 Nov '21

09 Nov '21

Klingon Word of the Day for Saturday, November 06, 2021 Klingon word: QIt Part of speech: adv Definition: slowly Source: TKD This Klingon Word of the Day is brought to you by qurgh (qurgh(a)kli.org)

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Klingon Word of the Day: taj Hol
by Klingon Word of the Day 09 Nov '21

09 Nov '21

Klingon Word of the Day for Tuesday, November 09, 2021 Klingon word: taj Hol Part of speech: noun Definition: propaganda Source: qep'a' 28 This Klingon Word of the Day is brought to you by qurgh (qurgh(a)kli.org)

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'elaDya' lalDan - lam'a' Say'choHghach je ~ 'ay' Hut
by mayqel qunen'oS 09 Nov '21

09 Nov '21

ngaghmeH mIw lubopbogh lam’a’ Say’choHmoHmeH Ho’DoSmey je. 1) ngaghpu’chugh vay’, chIrgh ‘elpa’, Qunpu’vaD cha’nob nobchoHpa’, ‘ej chaHvaD jatlhchoHpa’, porghDaj Say’moH nuvvam net poQ. 2) motlh loD raS’IS bop ngaghmeH mIw lam’a’. 3) pe’vIl wa’ ngaghpu’chugh latlh, lam’a’ ngel latlhvam, ‘ej ‘ut Say’choHmoHmeH Ho’DoSmey le’. chIlu’; ghu’vam lam’a’ Say’choHmeH Ho’DoS je. Qunpu’ cholchoHpa’ nuv, porghDaj Say’choHmoH net poQ. chotlu’; wanI’vam chotwI’ je lam’a’ Say’choHmoHmeH Ho’DoS je. 1) Sarvam lam’a’ qab law’ Hoch qab puS, ‘ej Qobchu’. 2) vengDaq chotwI’ tu’pu’be’bogh tu’lu’chugh, pa’ SaHmo’ chotwI’vam, qaSbogh lam’a’mo’ pIrHa’choH Humanpu’ Ha’DIbaHmey yotlhmey je. 3) Qunpu’ DaqDaq qaSpu’chugh HeSvam, ‘argh Sarvam lam’a’. 4) maqlegh chotlu’pu’chugh, Saghchu’ Sarvam lam’a’. 5) vavDaj SoSDaj ‘IpnalDaj joq chotchugh vay’, qaSbogh lam’a’mo’ latlh raS’ISmey lInglaHbe’ San’emDermey, ‘ej wejHa’ Heghpu’ boghbogh ghupu’. 6) nuvpu’ SumvaD lam’a’ lungejmoHmo’ chotwI’, bIghHa’Daq chotwI’vam lulannISlu’. 7) chotpu’bogh nuvpu’ bIjmeH Qunpu’, chotwI’pu’vamDaq lam’a’ lungeH Qun pa’logh net Har. 8) lam’a’vaD Qunpu’ bIj Damlu’, Hoch Sar HeS bop, ‘oHmo’ Do’Ha’choH HeSwI’, ‘ej choHmeH ghu’vam, qaSnIS Say’choHmoHmeH mIw. 9) DaqDaq tlhabchugh HeSwI’, Say’choHpu’pa’, pa’ yIttaHvIS ‘ej latlhpu’ ghomtaHvIS, chaHvaD lam’a’ ngejmoH. 10) cha’ ‘ay’ mIw ‘oH ‘Iw HeS Say’choHmoHmeH mIw’e’; ‘ay’ wa’DIch: chotwI’ tlha’mo’ Heghpu’bogh nuv qa’, qa’vamvaD chotwI’ DoHmoHlu’. ‘ay’ cha’DIch: ‘Iw HeS lam’a’ ngabmoHlu’. 11) juH qachDaq chotpu’chugh vay’, qachvam nganpu’Daj je luSay’choHmoHlu’meH, Say’choHmoHmeH Ho’DoS le’ lulo’nISlu’. qorDu’ lubopbogh lam’a’ Say’choHmoHmeH mIw je. wa’ puq poH neH luSIghbe’ lam’a’, San mIgh’e’ qaSmoHbogh lam’a’ je; Hoch qorDu’ nortlhampu’ SIghlaH je. vaj HeSpu’chugh wa’ tuqnIgh ‘op tuqnIgh ghap, qaSnIS ruv, ‘ej qaSmeH ruvvam, ngoy’ juHvam HeSpu’be’bogh tuqnIghpu’; vangpu’DI’ wa’ tuqnIgh, ngoy’choHpu’ Hoch juH tuqnIghpu’. chut pabHa’pu’chugh wa’ tuqnIgh, qoj vay’ QIHpu’chugh, qaSnISbogh ruv luSaHbe’chugh juHDaj latlh tuqnIgh, ‘ej Say’choHmoHmeH mIw luturbe’chugh, lam’a’ ngel SaHbe’bogh qorDu’vam Hoch. muD puH bIQmey je bopbogh lam’a’ Say’choHmoHmeH mIw je. muD: 1) ropmey rop’a’mey je qaSmoH muD lam’a’, ‘ej vabDot roghvaH Hoch ropmey mojchoHlaH ‘op rop’e’ qaSmoHbogh lam’a’. muD Dotlh SIghlaH muD lam’a’, ‘ej ropchoHmoHbogh tlhIchHommey tu’qom ‘aghlaH. muD lam’a’ ngabmoHmeH ‘ej rewve’ nItchoHmoHmeH *hippocrates* (bov tIQ Qel noy), HurDaq qulmey chu’pu’, ‘ej pa’ pIw QaQ Herghmey ‘Ir, San’emDer ghomey je meQpu’. puH: 1) SepDaq lamchugh ‘op Daq, ‘ej lammo’ Daqmeyvam, roplaHchugh vay’, pa’ qaSmoH lam’a’. SIghchuq qa’ porgh ‘umber je ‘e’ Har ‘elaDya’ Qel QeD tIQ, vaj wa’vaD mItnIS latlh ‘e’ ghojmoH. wa’vaD mIttaHvIS latlh, pIvtaH, ‘ach wa’vaD jochchoHDI’ latlh, qaSchoH rop. 2) ‘op yotlhDaq tInchoHmeH San’emDermey, yotlhmeyvamDaq bIQ qemlu’, ‘ej lam’a’ DI’onmey ‘aghmo’ Daqmeyvam, pa’ ‘elDI’ vay’, ghurlaH vay’vam porgh Hat. bIQmey: 1) lam’a’ DI’onmey ‘agh ‘op puH yIQ, vaj SumchoHchugh vay’, ghurlaH vay’vam porgh Hat. 2) bIQ’a’Daq bIQtIqmeyDaq je ‘op Quv le’ tu’lu’, ‘ej pa’ bIQ ‘elchugh vay’, roplaHchugh pagh vIQlaH nuvvam. nItHa’chugh vay’, pagh San mIgh SIQchoH vay’ ghaHvaD ‘e’ jInchugh latlh, wa’ bIQ Hal lo’chugh vay’vam, ‘ej bIQ Halvam rap lo’chugh je latlh, lam’a’ ngellaH latlhvam net Har. 3) ‘op DaqmeyDaq bIQtIqmey lurgh luchoHlu’pu’ qoj bIQtIqmey luwaQlu’pu’, vaj puHmey beQ ‘elpu’ bIQmeychaj. pa’ lam’a’ tu’lu’, ‘ej bechmoHchu’pu’ ‘ej ropmey qaSmoHpu’ lam’a’vam. -- Dana'an https://sacredtextsinklingon.wordpress.com/ Ζεὺς ἦν, Ζεὺς ἐστίν, Ζεὺς ἔσσεται· ὦ μεγάλε Ζεῦ

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