November 2016 - tlhIngan-Hol

A thought on the irrealis construction
by mayqel qunenoS 08 Nov '16

08 Nov '16

I remember having discussed here, that klingon doesn't possess the grammar to say "if klingon possessed an irrealis suffix, then I wouldn't be writing this post". So far so good.. I've been trying to find a way to overcome this problem, and I thought of the following approach: Lets say, I want to write "if I possessed foresight, I would have known my dog is stupid". If I write: {'op ben leSSov vIghajbe', 'ach ngugh vIghajchugh..} then the reader probably would understand what I'm trying to say. He would read "some years ago I don't have foresight, but at that time if I have it.." Intentionally, on the given translation I didn't write "some years ago I didn't have foresight, but at that time if I had it..", because I wanted to show that even if the mind of the reader doesn't "change to irrealis gear" then he will understand (hopefully) the intented meaning. So, I believe/think/assume/hope, that by an appropriate introduction one could find a workaround to compensate for the missing irrealis construction. Of course, I'm not writting this only to kill some time before I need to go to work again, so if someone could share some thoughts on this, then I would be happy (or sad depending on what he actually writes..) qunnoH ghoghwIj HablI'vo' vIngeHta'

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new words qepHom 2016 (geography)
by Lieven 08 Nov '16

08 Nov '16

The TalkNow: Learn Klingon software only contained a basic list of country names, which ist standard in their app. Maltz revealed some of the other countries, but also some interesting geography terms: ---begin quote--- Andorra 'anDo'ra' Argentina 'arHentInya' Austria 'oSteray' Belgium belghIya' Brazil bIraSIw Burma/Myanmar mIyama Cuba quba' Czech Republic cheSqa' Ecuador 'eqwaDor Estonia 'eStIy Georgia SaQatvelo' Iceland 'ISlan Ireland 'eyre' Kenya qenya' Libya lIbya' Liechtenstein lIHtentay' Luxembourg letSeburgh Morocco maghrIb Nigeria nayjerya' Poland po'lISqa' Slovakia SIlovenISqa' Syria Surya' Switzerland SuwISya' Venezuela veneSwe'la' The best Klingon word to use for the Terran idea of "country" (Germany, Sweden, Nigeria, etc.) is {Sep}. The word for "grid" on a spreadsheet (tlhat) can also be used for the lines (grid) on a map. equator (n.) ghaptal remote, small, desolate place (n.) naw'wat Allegheny (River, Mountains; US) 'a'leghen'I' Irrawaddy (River in Burma/Myanmar) 'eyawaDIy Jerusalem yeru'Sala'yIm New York nuyorgh Pittsburgh (US) pItlhbergh Continents (Terran) Africa 'avrI'qa' Antarctica 'antartIq Australia 'aSralya' Asia 'aSya' Europe 'ewrop North America 'amerI'qa' 'ev chan 'ev South America 'amerI'qa' tIng chan tIng ---end quote--- -- Lieven L. Litaer aka Quvar valer 'utlh Grammarian of the KLI http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher http://www.klingonwiki.net

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Art presentation in Pittsburgh?!
by Michael Roney, Jr. 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

>Others were used in Andrew Miller's Art presentation in a Museum of Pittsburgh, which happened on the same weekend. > There's an art presentation in Pittsburgh that somehow involves new Klingon vocabulary? ~naHQun -- ~Michael Roney, Jr. Freelance Translator

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new words qepHom 2016 (miscellaneous)
by Lieven 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

At this year's qepHom, we received lots of new words. Some of them were wishes by qepHom attendees and others. Others were used in Andrew Miller's Art presentation in a Museum of Pittsburgh, which happened on the same weekend. Marc Okrand gave me the list in english alphabetical order, so for reading convenience I re-arranged them in a somehow logical order. This is a list of terms I could not add to any of the lists. Some of these were certainly also used during the art presentation. Some words are extended meanings of existing words. ---begin quote--- agreement, contract, commitment mab bathtub, swimming pool DoQmIv'a' when needed, distinguish by qualifiers: Say'moHmeH DoQmIv'a', QalmeH DoQmIv'a' beacon rI'meH wovmoHwI' brake chungHa'wI' characteristic, trait DI'on letter, written character ngutlh lightning pe'bIl magic, wizardry 'IDnar mathematician mI' tej mattress QongDaq 'echlet tun (a very non-Klingon concept!) nerve (anatomy, physiology) Hutvav neural synapse Hutvav rarwI' pin (straight) 'emvI' studio, workspace jInmol pa' subconscious mind yab qoD unicycle wa' rutlh qam Do Duj [verbs] drive (a land vehicle) SeD float (in/on air) 'al manufacture, construct, put together mutlh order (in a restaurant, from a catalog, etc.) vun pin, attach or fasten with a pin vev hectic, very active, lively ghan peaceful, calm ghanHa' wrong, awry waS Note the difference between three words conventionally translated as "wrong." {muj} is "be incorrect, factually wrong," {waS} is "be amiss, awry" (something has gone wrong, this didn't turn out according to plan), and {QIH} is "mistreat." ---end quote--- Additional information while talking to Okrand: When {DoQmIv'a'} is a big tub, then - of course - a {DoQmIvHom} is a small one, so it can be used for the meaning of a "bucket", or anything similar. [note: Klingon words were written in bold face. I've added brackets for format-free emails] -- Lieven L. Litaer aka Quvar valer 'utlh Grammarian of the KLI http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher http://www.klingonwiki.net

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Klingon Word of the Day: DaSjaj
by qurgh＠wizage.net 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

Klingon Word of the Day for Monday, November 07, 2016 Klingon word: DaSjaj Part of speech: noun Definition: Monday Source: qepHom 2013 This Klingon Word of the Day is brought to you by qurgh (qurgh(a)kli.org)

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new words qepHom 2016 (city terms)
by Lieven 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

At this year's qepHom, we received lots of new words. Some of them were wishes by qepHom attendees and others. Others were used in Andrew Miller's Art presentation in a Museum of Pittsburgh, which happened on the same weekend. Marc Okrand gave me the list in english alphabetical order, so for reading convenience I re-arranged them in a somehow logical order. These are terms about things you may seen in town. ---begin quote--- block (city block) taw 'ay' bookmobile paq Duj fountain bIQ ghItmoHwI' from the verb ghIt "flow (e.g., water), gush, spout" landmark qach noy (building), Daq noy (not a building) librarian paq nojwI', De' QulwI' library (building) paq nojwI' qach library (public) paq nojwI' tum monument, memorial van Hew (sculpture), lat or van qach (building) museum 'angweD park (e.g., recreational) yotlh planetarium logh chal je 'angweD, planetarium (building) logh chal je 'angweD qach plaza, courtyard ghommeH yotlh postal service QIn tum post office (building) QIn tum qach public area tlhop unit of area (27 square 'ujmey) morgh ---end quote--- -- Lieven L. Litaer aka Quvar valer 'utlh Grammarian of the KLI http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher http://www.klingonwiki.net

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Re: [tlhIngan Hol] Anyone wan to help design a Klingon ruler?
by Michael Roney, Jr. 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

I realize we just got lots of new words, but has anyone recently asked for a way to talk about less than 1 'uj? Especially with a physical 'uj stick in the works? ~Michael Roney, Jr. Sent from my Fire Phone 🔥 On November 4, 2016, at 06:57, De'vID <de.vid.jonpin(a)gmail.com> wrote: On 4 November 2016 at 06:41, Anthony Appleyard <a.appleyard(a)btinternet.com> wrote: > ghItlhlu' :- >> Just to clarify what I wrote earlier: 2'3.1 and 2'3.2 would be how you >> write 1/3 and 1/3, respectively, in the 3-adic system. I had >> interpreted your original message to mean that you wanted to design a >> ruler using the ternary Klingon counting system. If you actually mean >> 1/10 and 2/10, then 0.1 and 0.2 is fine. > > 'oqranD yIghel?? nuq wIghel? qatlh? We know from TKD and the BoP poster that Klingons have adopted the decimal system. -- De'vID _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol(a)lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org

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Maltz about {H}
by Lieven 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

There are frequent arguements about how to prounounce Klingon H. Comparing sound examples from Wikipedia with words spoken on the tapes are more confusing than helpful. The main question was: Is H velar [x] or uvular [X]? Marc Okrand has a clear answer to this, but does understand that many people pronounce that different anyway: ---begin quote--- H is supposed to be velar [x]. Your description of gh is correct: "Almost the same as H but voiced." H is a voiceless velar fricative; gh is a voiced velar fricative. You're also right that H is "very strong." q is a uvular stop; Q is a uvular affricate. (There is no velar stop or uvular fricative.) Since the H sound does not occur in English (and since I don't use IPA in TKD), I was looking for a way to describe the sound that would help English speakers get it right or nearly right. I came up with the example words Bach, l'chaim (Yiddish), and Tijuana and Baja (Spanish), hoping readers would have heard these words pronounced in the language the words were from or something close to that (as opposed to Anglicized [bɑk], [tijǝwɑnǝ], [bɑhɑ], for example). Technically, I suppose, these were not great examples because, in any given language, there are different ways to pronounce this sound (actually, I should say "phoneme" rather than "sound"). In Spanish, for instance, the sound written with a "j", that I wanted to liken to a Klingon H, is sometimes velar, sometimes more palatal, and sometimes more uvular, depending on dialect, surrounding vowels, etc. As I understand it, in German (or at least in some dialects of German), the sound written ch may be [ç] (a palatal fricative), [X], or [x], depending on where it falls in the word and/or the preceding vowel. So it's understandable that there may be disagreement about what H is supposed to be. As I say, the idea was to get English speakers to get it more or less right from a written, nontechnical description. Also, as I think I've mentioned in the past, one of the things I was thinking about when writing TKD was making it, sometimes, a parody of those language books that have only suggestions of pronunciations and dictionaries that have ambiguous meanings for words. - Marc ---end quote--- -- Lieven L. Litaer aka Quvar valer 'utlh Grammarian of the KLI http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher http://www.klingonwiki.net

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new words qepHom 2016 (share)
by Lieven 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

The Facebook-Translation team will be happy with this: ---begin quote--- There are two words for "share." When A shares something (C) with B, the verb to use is {bon} ("share with") and the construction is B-vaD C {bon} A (with appropriate verb prefixes depending on what A and C are). In this case, C belongs to or is controlled by A and A chooses to share it with B. When A and B share something with each other (share some {gagh}, say), the verb to use is {lIn} ("share") and the construction is {C lulIn A B je} (or {C lIn A B je} if C is plural, and, again, with appropriate verb prefixes). In this case, the speaker is noncommittal about whether A or B is the one who decided to do the sharing with the other. There is an idiomatic expression: {lInchuq} "share each other." This is not a euphemism, but Maltz admitted it's a little risqué. {lInchuq} ("they share each other") means that they (whoever is being talked about) have a physical relationship of some sort. The phrase is general — it doesn't imply anything about exactly what they do physically. It also doesn't necessarily mean that they are doing something right now (at the time of speaking). The relationship could be relatively light (a little nibbling) or heavier (really biting) or beyond (Maltz thought that Terrans might find that part a bit risqué). As with other verbs with {-chuq}, the prefix has to indicate a plural subject and no object: {malInchuq} {SulInchuq} ---end quote--- By the way, Okrand was suprised when I pointed at him that {bon} is {nob} ("give") backwards. It was definitely not intentional. (but I think it's agood way to memorize.) [note: Klingon words were written in bold face. I've added brackets for format-free emails] -- Lieven L. Litaer aka Quvar valer 'utlh Grammarian of the KLI http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher http://www.klingonwiki.net

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new words qepHom 2016 (art)
by Lieven 07 Nov '16

07 Nov '16

At this year's qepHom, we received lots of new words. Some of them were wishes by qepHom attendees and others. Others were used in Andrew Miller's Art presentation in a Museum of Pittsburgh, which happened on the same weekend. Marc Okrand gave me the list in english alphabetical order, so for reading convenience I re-arranged them in a somehow logical order. This list talks about art ---begin quote--- "Klingon for the Galactic Traveler" (p. 79) says there is no single word for "art" or "artwork." This refers to visual art (painting, sculpture, etc.). {meHghem} ("arts, the arts, culture") is a bigger, more comprehensive term covering "the arts" or "art" as opposed to "science." So it includes music, theater, dance, etc. as well as visual art. It's "culture" in this sense. Similarly, {vIqraq} ("artifact, work of art") is more general than a visual piece of art. It covers that, but also an artifact (not in the archaeological sense), handicraft, gizmo, gadget, contraption, machine, device, etc. – that is, something manufactured/made. shape, form, appearance, configuration (n.) tu'qom poem (n.) ghuQ pane, panel, sheet (not for bed) (n.) vol jazz (music) (n.) (loanword from DIvI' Hol) jeS / jeS QoQ juggle (objects, not tasks) (v.) jaDchu' mosaic (n.) majyang mIllogh ---end quote--- [note: Klingon words were written in bold face. I've added brackets for format-free emails] -- Lieven L. Litaer aka Quvar valer 'utlh Grammarian of the KLI http://www.facebook.com/Klingonteacher http://www.klingonwiki.net

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