Am 09.11.2021 um 18:46 schrieb nIqolay Q:

*reH mu'mey chu' SamlaH mayqel. So'laHbe' mu'meyvetlh. :D

teHbej. not vay' lIj 'Internet.

*wa' Doch vISov vIneH: pong <Alice> mughmeH <QelIS> lo'lu'. qatlh Qay wab chellu'?*

wej meqmey vIghaj. wa'DIch: pong HoS 'oHbe' Alice'e' 'e' vIHar; tlhIngan Hol rurbogh pong'e' vIneH. roD Qay wab, qay wab ghap lughaj tlhIngan pongmey. ngutlh tIn 'oH ngutlh wa'DIch'e' roD 'e' poQmo' De'wI' patmey, Qay wab vIwIv. cha': <Alice> wab vIbuSDI', <'elIS> rur; 'ach Do'Ha' qaghwI' lajbe' 'op De'wI' patmey. rut <elIS> moj <'elIS>. mIwvam vIlajqangbe'. wej: loQ <qeylIS> rur <QelIS> 'e' vIparHa'. -- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" http://www.tlhInganHol.com http://klingon.wiki/En/AliceInWonderland

“Once,” said the Mock Turtle at last, with a deep sigh, “I was a real Turtle.” -- (Lewis Carroll, Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland) Voragh From: tlhIngan-Hol On Behalf Of Alan Anderson On Tue, Nov 9, 2021 at 10:24 AM mayqel qunen'oS <mihkoun@gmail.com<mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote: I mean, is {Dul} a "sigh"? Or is it "to sigh"? The explanation is clear in the Appendix of the book itself. "To sigh is {Dul}. This verb takes no object." (page 238)

My copy has no appendix. The last page is Chapter 24. Also, it is only in Klingon. There is no English translation. My copy has a copyright date of 2020. It looks just like the ones shown in the KLI webstore. Is there a newer version with an appendix? From: tlhIngan-Hol [mailto:tlhingan-hol-bounces@lists.kli.org] On Behalf Of Alan Anderson Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 9:51 AM To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org Subject: Re: [tlhIngan Hol] look what the cat dragged in The explanation is clear in the Appendix of the book itself. -- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com

Quite. Thank you. -----Original Message----- From: tlhIngan-Hol [mailto:tlhingan-hol-bounces@lists.kli.org] On Behalf Of Lieven L. Litaer Sent: Tuesday, November 9, 2021 9:47 PM To: tlhingan-hol@kli.org Subject: Re: [tlhIngan Hol] look what the cat dragged in I believe you are mixing this up with "The Wizard of Oz", which has 24 chapters and no appendix. This new book is "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland": https://alice.klingonisch.de/english Am 09.11.2021 um 23:13 schrieb Scott D. Randel:

My copy has no appendix. The last page is Chapter 24. Also, it is only in Klingon. There is no English translation.

My copy has a copyright date of 2020. It looks just like the ones shown in the KLI webstore. Is there a newer version with an appendix? -- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" http://www.tlhInganHol.com http://klingon.wiki/En/AliceInWonderland

tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org -- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. https://www.avg.com

veD fur (n) veDDIr pelt (skin with fur still attached) (n) (KGT 58): Accompanying sleeves (tlhaymey), originally not parts of the tunic [yIvbeH] itself, were generally made of animal pelts (veDDIrmey), skin (DIr) with fur (veD) still attached. MO, st.klingon 3/23/1998): Since number is an optional category in Klingon (the plural suffix may be left off even if the word refers to more than one thing), {DIr} may refer to “a skin” or “skins” or “skin” as a material or substance. Likewise for {veDDIr} “pelt, pelts”. So the problem of which plural suffix to use comes up only when one feels the need to be very specific. If I understand Maltz correctly, it works like this: The general plural suffix {-mey} is not used with body parts (except by poets, of course). Thus {DIrmey} “skins” and {veDDIrmey} “pelt” are not (or, perhaps better, are no longer) body parts, but rather are materials from which things (clothing or blankets, for example) may be made. They've lost their association with the creatures that originally had them. (This is kind of like the distinction in English between beef, which is eaten, and cattle, which isn't.) If there still is that association, that is, if the creatures still have their skin, or if it's a creature that has multiple skins (maybe layers, maybe different kinds of skin on different parts of the body), or if the skin just came off either by natural causes (as with Alan Anderson's snakes) or by the creatures being, well, skinned, then the body-part plural suffix {-Du'} may be used: {DIrDu'}. But {DIr} alone, without a suffix, is heard most often. -- Voragh, Ca'Non Master of the Klingons _____________________________________________________________________ From: De'vID On Thu, 11 Nov 2021 at 14:05, Jeremy Silver wrote: I also note on the entry for {pob} the translation only says "animal's hair or fur". Does this differ from {veD} in some way? Like "this is how you describe the veD on the body of the animal"? My understanding is that this is just saying that {pob} isn't limited to Klingons (or humanoids). So I think I would phrase your sentence in the other direction: "{veD} is how you would describe the {pob} on the body of the animal".

On Thu, 11 Nov 2021 at 17:37, Lieven L. Litaer <levinius@gmx.de> wrote:

Am 11.11.2021 um 16:11 schrieb De'vID:

...

My understanding is that this is just saying that {pob} isn't limited to Klingons (or humanoids). So I think I would phrase your sentence in the other direction: "{veD} is how you would describe the {pob} on the body of the animal".

The main reason for this entry was to say that animals do not have {jIb}, they have {pob}.

Well, if that's what you want to convey, the new info should not have been added to {pob} but to {jIb}: "hair (on head, but not for animals)"! ;-) -- De'vID