How to say "I want to be good at Klingon" ?
I have been wondering, what is the best way to convey "I want to be good at klingon"? The most accurate verb seems <po'> (be expert, skilled) but I'm not sure how best to convey the "at" in "expert *at *klingon", how to make the link between the expertise and the object of said expertise. Do I just use -vaD ? 1/ < tlhIngan HolvaD jIpo’ vIneH > or is it best to use some kind of construction with < bop > (be about, be concerned with), as in "I want to be expert concerning Klingon"? 2/ < tlhIngan Hol bop lu’ DI’ jIpo’ vIneH > 3/ < tlhIngan Hol bop lu’ taHvIS jIpo’ vIneH > 4/ < tlhIngan Hol bop lu’ chugh jIpo’ vIneH > 5/ < tlhIngan Hol bopwI’vaD jIpo’ vIneH > 6/ < tlhIngan Hol bopbogh SovvaD jIpo’ vIneH > What do you think makes the most sense out of these options and what is just "chatlh" ? Do you have another solution you'd like to suggest on this ? Satlho’ ! :)
tlhIngan Hol po'wI' vImoj vIneH I want to become an expert of the klingon language tlhIngan Hol vIlo'laHchu' vIneH I want to be able to use klingon perfectly tlhIngan Hol vIjatlhlaHchu' vIneH I want to be able to speak klingon perfectly tlhIngan Hol vIghItlhlaHchu' vIneH I want to be able to write klingon perfectly tlhIngan Hol vIjatlhlaHchu' vIneH 'ej vIghItlhlaHchu' vIneH je. I want to be able to speak and write klingon perfectly. qunnoq On Aug 26, 2017 17:21, "Aurélie Demonchaux" <demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:
I have been wondering, what is the best way to convey "I want to be good at klingon"?
The most accurate verb seems <po'> (be expert, skilled) but I'm not sure how best to convey the "at" in "expert *at *klingon", how to make the link between the expertise and the object of said expertise.
Do I just use -vaD ? 1/ < tlhIngan HolvaD jIpo’ vIneH >
or is it best to use some kind of construction with < bop > (be about, be concerned with), as in "I want to be expert concerning Klingon"?
2/ < tlhIngan Hol bop lu’ DI’ jIpo’ vIneH >
3/ < tlhIngan Hol bop lu’ taHvIS jIpo’ vIneH >
4/ < tlhIngan Hol bop lu’ chugh jIpo’ vIneH >
5/ < tlhIngan Hol bopwI’vaD jIpo’ vIneH >
6/ < tlhIngan Hol bopbogh SovvaD jIpo’ vIneH >
What do you think makes the most sense out of these options and what is just "chatlh" ? Do you have another solution you'd like to suggest on this ?
Satlho’ ! :)
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On Sat, Aug 26, 2017 at 10:21 AM, Aurélie Demonchaux < demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:
5/ < tlhIngan Hol bopwI’vaD jIpo’ vIneH >
You said something really interesting there, Aurélie. What's a {bopwI'}, I wonder? A pertainer? (Definitely not a good English word!) I can't quite wrap my brain around it, but I think it's my own fault, not that {bopwI'} is nonsense. mujangmeH chaq jatlh tlhIngan <bopbogh vay' neH 'oHbej bopwI''e'> ~mIp'av
A < bopwI’ > would be a topic, the way I see it. It may be a word that has to be used always with something else, similar to "-monger" in English. It means "someone who trades in / who peddles", but you never use "monger" on its own, it doesn't make sense because you always need to specify what is being peddled, so you get "fishmonger", "rumourmonger"... Similarly with < bopwI' >, it's "something which concerns/is about", so you'd always need to specify "what" it is about, by putting a noun before < bopwI' >. thus you'd get < QeD bopwI’ > for "science topic" for instance. At least that's my theory on how it works, who knows what matlh would have to say about this ? :) 2017-08-26 22:30 GMT+02:00 Ed Bailey <bellerophon.modeler@gmail.com>:
On Sat, Aug 26, 2017 at 10:21 AM, Aurélie Demonchaux < demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:
5/ < tlhIngan Hol bopwI’vaD jIpo’ vIneH >
You said something really interesting there, Aurélie. What's a {bopwI'}, I wonder? A pertainer? (Definitely not a good English word!) I can't quite wrap my brain around it, but I think it's my own fault, not that {bopwI'} is nonsense. mujangmeH chaq jatlh tlhIngan <bopbogh vay' neH 'oHbej bopwI''e'>
~mIp'av
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Aurelie, these are indeed very interesting thoughts/suggestions on {bopwI'}. I wonder how the rest of the people here view them. qunnoq On Aug 27, 2017 11:16, "Aurélie Demonchaux" <demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:
A < bopwI’ > would be a topic, the way I see it.
It may be a word that has to be used always with something else, similar to "-monger" in English. It means "someone who trades in / who peddles", but you never use "monger" on its own, it doesn't make sense because you always need to specify what is being peddled, so you get "fishmonger", "rumourmonger"...
Similarly with < bopwI' >, it's "something which concerns/is about", so you'd always need to specify "what" it is about, by putting a noun before < bopwI' >.
thus you'd get < QeD bopwI’ > for "science topic" for instance.
At least that's my theory on how it works, who knows what matlh would have to say about this ? :)
2017-08-26 22:30 GMT+02:00 Ed Bailey <bellerophon.modeler@gmail.com>:
On Sat, Aug 26, 2017 at 10:21 AM, Aurélie Demonchaux < demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:
5/ < tlhIngan Hol bopwI’vaD jIpo’ vIneH >
You said something really interesting there, Aurélie. What's a {bopwI'}, I wonder? A pertainer? (Definitely not a good English word!) I can't quite wrap my brain around it, but I think it's my own fault, not that {bopwI'} is nonsense. mujangmeH chaq jatlh tlhIngan <bopbogh vay' neH 'oHbej bopwI''e'>
~mIp'av
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Very interesting indeed, Aurélie! "Monger" certainly had not occurred to me. {joS bopwI'} seems like it would be best translated as "rumor monger." A {veS bopwI'}, though, seems like someone devoted to soldiering, rather than a warmonger (probably {noH numwI'} for that, but with no negative connotation for Klingons), and I'd call a fishmonger a {ghotI' ngevwI'}. (As an aside, I've heard someone use {bop'egh} in reference to a narcissist or someone preoccupied with his self-interest.) Your use of {bop} in the original post definitely made me think of topic, and of saying {tlhIngan Hol'e' jIpo' vIneH} "As for Klingon, I want to be skilled." I'm not too sure about {-vaD}, as {tlhIngan HolvaD jIpo' vIneH} seems to imply that the language will benefit from the speaker's eventual expertise. The way I like best was qunnoq's first suggestion, {tlhIngan Hol po'wI' vImoj vIneH}. ~mIp'av
On Sun, Aug 27, 2017 at 5:35 PM, Ed Bailey <bellerophon.modeler@gmail.com> wrote:
Very interesting indeed, Aurélie! "Monger" certainly had not occurred to me. {joS bopwI'} seems like it would be best translated as "rumor monger." A {veS bopwI'}, though, seems like someone devoted to soldiering, rather than a warmonger (probably {noH numwI'} for that, but with no negative connotation for Klingons), and I'd call a fishmonger a {ghotI' ngevwI'}. (As an aside, I've heard someone use {bop'egh} in reference to a narcissist or someone preoccupied with his self-interest.)
I don't think Aurelie was suggesting "monger" as a translation of {bopwI'}, but rather as an example of an English word that needs another noun to make sense, like {bopwI'} would. The best way to translate "rumor monger" would probably just be {joSwI'}.
On Sun, Aug 27, 2017 at 7:43 PM, nIqolay Q <niqolay0@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, Aug 27, 2017 at 5:35 PM, Ed Bailey <bellerophon.modeler@gmail.com> wrote:
Very interesting indeed, Aurélie! "Monger" certainly had not occurred to me. {joS bopwI'} seems like it would be best translated as "rumor monger." A {veS bopwI'}, though, seems like someone devoted to soldiering, rather than a warmonger (probably {noH numwI'} for that, but with no negative connotation for Klingons), and I'd call a fishmonger a {ghotI' ngevwI'}. (As an aside, I've heard someone use {bop'egh} in reference to a narcissist or someone preoccupied with his self-interest.)
I don't think Aurelie was suggesting "monger" as a translation of {bopwI'}, but rather as an example of an English word that needs another noun to make sense, like {bopwI'} would. The best way to translate "rumor monger" would probably just be {joSwI'}.
I took "monger" as a useful idea for understanding {bopwI'}, and it is, mainly for the reason you cite. Obviously it's not generally the best translation of {bopwI'}, but I like to take the ball and run with it. {bop} is a really interesting word. Trying to understand {bopwI'}, an example popped into my head: jatlhchugh vay' <parmaqqaypu' bopwI'mey tIngu'!>, ghaytan paqmey bommey ghuQmey ghe'naQmey je tetlh ja' latlh. BTW I'd just translate {joSwI'} as "a gossip." ~mIp'av
participants (4)
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Aurélie Demonchaux -
Ed Bailey -
mayqel qunenoS -
nIqolay Q