[tlhIngan Hol] {-Daq} and {-bogh} and {Sumbogh} and {Hopbogh}

SuStel sustel at trimboli.name
Mon Feb 7 06:15:54 PST 2022

On 2/7/2022 7:10 AM, mayqel qunen'oS wrote:
> However, we *can* say {tawDaq Sumbogh Ha'DIbaH vIlegh}. And here we'd 
> have two possible meanings:
> (Although I'm not sure if the relative clause is the entire {tawDaq 
> Sumbogh Ha'DIbaH} or just the {Sumbogh Ha'DIbaH}).
> 1. "I see the animal which is near the street". Meaning "I see an 
> animal, and that animal is near the street".

In this interpretation, the relative clause includes the *tawDaq. *It is 
an /animal which is near the street,/ not just an /animal which is nearby./

> 2. "I see at the street the animal which is near". Meaning "I'm at the 
> street, and while I'm there, I see the animal which is near". Near 
> where? Near me (because of the deixis crap which governs the use of 
> {Sum} and {Hop}).

In this interpretation, the relative cause does not include the 
*tawDaq.* It is an /animal which is nearby,/ not an /animal which is 
near the street./

> And I don't know why, but I get the impression that case number 2 is 
> an exception to the "rule" that the subject of {Sum}/{Hop} is whatever 
> is being near/far the {-Daq}ed noun.

It's not a rule; it's just what the words mean. *tawDaq Sum Ha'DIbaH:* 
the animal is in the state /be nearby,/ and that state occurs /at the 
street./ The key is understanding that a locative tells you where the 
action takes place, not where the subject is when the action takes 
place. Most of the time, the subject takes place where the action is: 
*ropyaHDaq Haq HaqwI'*/A surgeon performs surgery an in infirmary,/ but 
with *Sum* and *Hop,* the meanings of the verbs make it clear that the 
action of being nearby or being far away takes place where the subject 
is not. It's not special grammar. It's just what the words mean.

Your interpretation number 2 is not an exception. There, the locative 
*tawDaq* is not the location of the being nearby; it's the location of 
the seeing. The seeing, performed by you, occurs in the street. The 
being nearby, performed by the animal, occurs, by implication, at your 
location. At your location, the animal is nearby. The locative is not 
part of the relative clause at all.

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