[tlhIngan Hol] expressing goddess

Will Martin willmartin2 at mac.com
Tue Apr 13 13:41:00 PDT 2021


Okay, so a new question occurred to me… Maybe we’ve been asking the wrong question.

Do we have any sex-gendered nouns besides mother, father, and other blood relatives or spouses? Even then, Okrand slid in some odd ones, like {tey’}, which basically means “a not-gender-specific child of a same-gender sibling of one of your parents”.

If there are no non-blood-relative-or-spouse sex-gender-specific nouns, then the definitions are likely generally mail as a simple style point in Okrand’s writing, like saying, “A person must trust his instincts,” instead of “her instincts” or “his or her instincts” or “their instincts”. It’s just the way he writes them, by default.

charghwI’ ‘utlh
(ghaH, ghaH, -Daj)



> On Apr 13, 2021, at 3:41 PM, Will Martin <willmartin2 at mac.com> wrote:
> 
> Also, we have a word for “empress”. We don’t have one for “chancellor-ess”.
> 
> charghwI’ vaghnerya’ngan
> 
> rInpa’ bomnIS be’’a’ pI’.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 13, 2021, at 12:32 PM, Lieven L. Litaer <levinius at gmx.de <mailto:levinius at gmx.de>> wrote:
>> 
>> Am 13.04.2021 um 16:33 schrieb De'vID:
>>> so-and-so as well as "lady" so-and-so, and thus the definition was
>>> expanded. The sexism in the vocabulary, if it's there, was accidental.
>> 
>> And still, the sexism is in the English translation, not Klingon.
>> 
>>> Similarly, we have only heard about Klingon emperors on the TV shows and
>>> movies. (Are there any screen canon Klingon empresses? Maybe we missed
>>> an opportunity with L'Rell.) Undoubtedly, were a Star Trek writer to
>>> mention a Klingon empress on the show, Dr. Okrand would reveal that
>>> {voDleH}/{ta'} could also mean "empress", or alternatively reveal the
>>> correct Klingon term for this title.
>> 
>> Okrand had a good chance in ST6, when Azetbur took over the role of her
>> father, chancellor Gorkon. In the scene, she was addressed as "madame
>> chancellor".
>> 
>> The new word {Qang} for "chancellor" appeared in the addendum of TKD,
>> which means it was discovered for Star Trek 6.
>> 
>> Of course, we can still not know if Okrand was aware of the ending of
>> the movie, maybe not knowing that there was a female version of
>> chancellor needed. But he translated a dialogue for a scene wit that
>> female chancellor, and the script was very clear. Unfortunately, the
>> word Chancellor did not appear in the translation.
>> 
>> Of course, this is about chancellor, not empereror.
>> 
>>> {voDleH}/{ta'} is gender-neutral like {joH}, although, given the absence
>>> of other gendered nouns and titles in the vocabulary, this seems likely.
>> 
>> I think so, too. Also remember that {ghaH} and {chaH} are gender-neutral.
>> 
>> --
>> Lieven L. Litaer
>> see
>> http://klingon.wiki/En/ST6 <http://klingon.wiki/En/ST6>
>> http://klingon.wiki/En/Gender
>> http://klingon.wiki/Word/Qang
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