Both {rIp} and {yej} mean "assembly, council". Is there any kind of difference between them, or are they perfect synonyms ? ~ m. qunen'oS
On 6/25/2019 8:50 AM, mayqel qunen'oS wrote:
Both {rIp} and {yej} mean "assembly, council".
Is there any kind of difference between them, or are they perfect synonyms ?
Unknown. -- SuStel http://trimboli.name
On Tue, 25 Jun 2019 at 14:50, mayqel qunen'oS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
Both {rIp} and {yej} mean "assembly, council".
Is there any kind of difference between them, or are they perfect synonyms ?
Types of {rIp}: {quprIp} Types of {yej}: {yejquv}, {yejHaD}, {yej'an} You tell me if they're perfect synonyms. -- De'vID
On 6/25/2019 9:08 AM, De'vID wrote:
On Tue, 25 Jun 2019 at 14:50, mayqel qunen'oS <mihkoun@gmail.com <mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote:
Both {rIp} and {yej} mean "assembly, council".
Is there any kind of difference between them, or are they perfect synonyms ?
Types of {rIp}: {quprIp}
Types of {yej}: {yejquv}, {yejHaD}, {yej'an}
You tell me if they're perfect synonyms.
An organization dedicated to scholastic pursuits or research is a *yejHaD* /institute/ or /institution/ or a *yej'an* /society./ The distinction between *yejHaD* and *yej'an* is not clear, though the former is usually — but not always — used for larger organizations. It is not known whether the first syllable of these words *(**yej**)* is *yej* /council, assembly,/ but there could be some historic connection. /[HolQeD]/ With this warning from Okrand regarding analyzing *yej* in these words**, I would avoid drawing a conclusion about the difference between *rIp* and *yej* based on those words. -- SuStel http://trimboli.name
That’s an old question that is still unclear AFAIK. Here’s what I have in my notes: rIp council, assembly (n) [not used in the paq’batlh] quprIp Council of Elders (n) yej assembly, council (n) [not used in the paq’batlh] - yIvuv, tIquvma. pagh SoH. yejvamvaD jeSmeH DIb Dabajbe'pu'. Show respect, T'Kuvma. You are nothing. You have not earned a seat at this council. (DSC/Qov "Battle At the Binary Stars" [non-canon!]) yejHaD institute (KLI), institution KGT (n) yejquv High Council (n) yej'an society (e.g. scholarly society) (n) (HQ 4.4): The distinction between {yejHaD} and {yej'an} is not clear, though the former is usually - but not always - used for larger organizations. It is not known whether the first syllable of these words ({yej}) is {yej} “council, assembly”, but there could be some historic connection. I can’t see any difference as to how they are used. Has anyone ever asked Okrand? -- Voragh Ca'Non Master of the Klingons From: mayqel qunen'oS Both {rIp} and {yej} mean "assembly, council". Is there any kind of difference between them, or are they perfect synonyms ?
De'vID:
Types of {rIp}:> {quprIp}> Types of {yej}:> {yejquv}, {yejHaD}, {yej'an}> You tell me if they're perfect synonyms.
The words quprIp, yejquv, yejHaD, yej'an aren't synonyms. But can't one use {rIp} or {yej} on their own ? *Then* is the problem (or at least my problem..) Should I, or shouldn't I use {rIp} and {yej} interchangeably ? ~ m. qunen'oS
On Tue, 25 Jun 2019 at 15:28, mayqel qunen'oS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
De'vID:
Types of {rIp}:> {quprIp}> Types of {yej}:> {yejquv}, {yejHaD}, {yej'an}> You tell me if they're perfect synonyms.
The words quprIp, yejquv, yejHaD, yej'an aren't synonyms.
That wasn't the question. But anyway, as SuStel pointed out, Okrand said it's not known if the first syllable of {yejHaD} and {yej'an} are actually the word {yej}, so you really only have {quprIp} and {yejquv} to go on. There may or may not be some slight difference, such as how membership is decided. But there isn't sufficient information to know. But can't one use {rIp} or {yej} on their own ? *Then* is the problem (or
at least my problem..)
Should I, or shouldn't I use {rIp} and {yej} interchangeably ?
You can probably use them interchangeably for a particular council or assembly for which a word hasn't already been established, but once you've made the choice, you shouldn't switch. For example, you shouldn't suddenly refer to the *{qupyej} or the *{rIpquv} if you've already established these things are called {quprIp} and {yejquv}. Imagine that they're the English words "council" and "assembly". Are these synonymous? As generic terms, they're probably interchangeable in most cases, but you shouldn't refer to an organisation known as the "Council of Elders" as the "Assembly of Elders", and you shouldn't call the "High Council" by the "High Assembly". -- De'vID
On 6/25/2019 10:05 AM, De'vID wrote:
But can't one use {rIp} or {yej} on their own ? *Then* is the problem (or at least my problem..)
Should I, or shouldn't I use {rIp} and {yej} interchangeably ?
You can probably use them interchangeably for a particular council or assembly for which a word hasn't already been established, but once you've made the choice, you shouldn't switch. For example, you shouldn't suddenly refer to the *{qupyej} or the *{rIpquv} if you've already established these things are called {quprIp} and {yejquv}.
Imagine that they're the English words "council" and "assembly". Are these synonymous? As generic terms, they're probably interchangeable in most cases, but you shouldn't refer to an organisation known as the "Council of Elders" as the "Assembly of Elders", and you shouldn't call the "High Council" by the "High Assembly".
As part of a name, no. But it would be perfectly reasonable to address the Council of Elders as "this assembly." -- SuStel http://trimboli.name
De'vID:
You can probably use them interchangeably for a particular council or assembly for which a word hasn't already been established, but once you've made the choice, you shouldn't switch. For example, you shouldn't suddenly refer to the *{qupyej} or the *{rIpquv} if you've already established these things are called {quprIp} and {yejquv}.
What I'm wondering about, isn't whether I could rename the {quprIp} to {qupyej}, or the {yejquv} to {rIpquv}. I'm wondering whether I can use on their own and interchangeably the {rIp} and {yej}. Example: vIghro' tIQ wIje' 'e' bot rIp the council/assembly prohibited us bying an ancient cat vIghro' tIQ wIje' 'e' bot yej the council/assembly prohibited us bying an ancient cat 1st question: Can I use {rIp} and {yej} in this way ? (i.e. on their own; not being a part of a composite noun) 2nd question: Do both of the above sentences mean the same ? ~ m. qunen'oS
On Tue, 25 Jun 2019 at 16:25, mayqel qunen'oS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
1st question: Can I use {rIp} and {yej} in this way ? (i.e. on their own; not being a part of a composite noun)
What makes you think you can't?
2nd question: Do both of the above sentences mean the same ?
Unknown. -- De'vID
Qov certainly didn’t hesitate in Discovery: yIvuv, tIquvma. pagh SoH. yejvamvaD jeSmeH DIb Dabajbe'pu'. Show respect, T'Kuvma. You are nothing. You have not earned a seat at this council. (DSC/Qov "Battle at the Binary Stars") -- Voragh From: De'vID On Tue, 25 Jun 2019 at 16:25, mayqel qunen'oS wrote: Can I use {rIp} and {yej} in this way ? (i.e. on their own; not being a part of a composite noun) What makes you think you can't?
participants (4)
-
De'vID -
mayqel qunen'oS -
Steven Boozer -
SuStel