Re: [tlhIngan Hol] [Tlhingan-hol] Liquid Nitrogen
From the BOP Poster we have the N1-N2 noun-noun phrase {rugh bIQSIp} "anti-hydrogen" (lit. "antimatter hydrogen"). How is this grammatically different from *{betgham bIQSIp}?
For those not up on their Treknology: (ST Encyclopedia): Deuterium was also used as one of the reactants in the matter/antimatter reaction system in those ships' warp drive. The deuterium was the matter, and anti-hydrogen served as the antimatter. (TNG "Relics") FYI, {bIQSIp 'ugh} "deuterium isotope" (lit. "heavy hydrogen") also comes from the Poster comes from the BOP Poster. -- Voragh
-----Original Message----- Fiat Knox <fiat_knox@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
So, now we know that betgham means liquid (n). Does that mean we can now use a noun-noun construction and officially call liquid nitrogen *betgham voQSIp?* Ditto for, say, liquid oxygen, liquid hydrogen and liquid gold?
I doubt it, since "liquid" in "liquid oxygen" is not a noun but an adjective.
{betgham voQSIp} would seem to me to mean "liquid nitrogen" as in "the nitrogen which is present in this liquid" rather than "nitrogen in liquid form".
"The liquid's nitrogen" or "nitrogen of the liquid" would be other ways of putting it.
A bit like how I interpret {nuH pegh} (the TKD example) not as a weapon secret (one concerning a weapon) but as a particular weapon's secret.
And indeed TKD, says that "N1-N2 (that is, noun #1 followed by noun #2) would be <N2 of the N1.>", so {betgham voQSIp} would be something like "nitrogen of the liquid".
Cheers, Philip
For me, the N1-N2 construction has always meant that the set N2 is restricted to the subset represented by N1. Every single canon usage of this construction fits this interpretation, even numbers and titles. {yaS taj} 'of the universal set of all possible knives, the officer's" = the officer's knife.{romuluS HIq} of the set of liquors, the one from/made by Romulans{rugh bIQSIp} of the types of hydrogen, the anti-matter kind{voQSIp betgham} of the universal set of liquids, the one made from nitrogrn{cha' Dujmey} of the universal set of ships, two of them{qIrq HoD} of the universal set of captains, the one who is Kirk Trying to interpret N1-N2 in the opposite way, that N2 restricts or explains N1 is a kind of 'special pleading", usually using English as the basis of the interpretation. Also, if N1-N2 can be either pattern, it is only possible to tell which is being used by working backwards from the English again. But if you understand N1-N2 to be that N1 restricts N2, it works in Klingon every single time, without confusion. ter'eS
Or just as nuH pegh can be interpreted as "It's a weapon. It's secret," you could read betgham voQSIp as "It's a liquid. It's nitrogen," using the same construction as Hov leng Star Trek. Earlier, chuch bIQ was one usage, rather than bIQ chuch for water ice. But chuch bIQ could mean ice water, water obtained from ice - for example, runoff from a glacier. They might need the water that came off some melting ice, rather than stuff synthesised from a replicator. On Friday, 5 August 2016, 18:39, Terrence Donnelly <terrence.donnelly@sbcglobal.net> wrote: For me, the N1-N2 construction has always meant that the set N2 is restricted to the subset represented by N1. Every single canon usage of this construction fits this interpretation, even numbers and titles. {yaS taj} 'of the universal set of all possible knives, the officer's" = the officer's knife.{romuluS HIq} of the set of liquors, the one from/made by Romulans{rugh bIQSIp} of the types of hydrogen, the anti-matter kind{voQSIp betgham} of the universal set of liquids, the one made from nitrogrn{cha' Dujmey} of the universal set of ships, two of them{qIrq HoD} of the universal set of captains, the one who is Kirk Trying to interpret N1-N2 in the opposite way, that N2 restricts or explains N1 is a kind of 'special pleading", usually using English as the basis of the interpretation. Also, if N1-N2 can be either pattern, it is only possible to tell which is being used by working backwards from the English again. But if you understand N1-N2 to be that N1 restricts N2, it works in Klingon every single time, without confusion. ter'eS _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
participants (3)
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Fiat Knox -
Steven Boozer -
Terrence Donnelly