On 1/26/2022 7:16 PM, Iikka Hauhio wrote:
ghunchu'wI':
No. Leaving out spaces is not what makes a compound noun “legitimate”. Being a common combination is what grants it its own dictionary entry. Things like {ropyaH qach} for “hospital” and {'Iw HIq} for “bloodwine” are lexicalized terms because they have a specific meaning when the words are used together, regardless of whether or not they remain separated by a space when used.
You must have misunderstood me. *'Iw HIq* and *ropyaH qach *are lexicalized, I haven't denied that. Both compounds are included in a dictionary, so they both are legitimate (this is Okrand's definition of "legitimate").
As De'vID has just pointed out, the term "compound" has a specific meaning in TKD: it refers to complex nouns formed by putting together two or more other nouns. *jolpa'* is a compound; *'Iw HIq* is not.
My argument was that they should be written without space: in TKD Okrand says that legitimate copounds don't have a space.
Which means that a noun-noun like *'Iw HIq* is not a compound noun, not that it can't appear as a "legitimate" entry in a dictionary.
SuStel:
You're saying that the current usage is not consistent. I completely agree. There are examples of compound nouns I wouldn't expect to be compounded, and examples of noun-nouns that I could easily imagine being compounded.
You're saying there are possible ways to write consistently. Again, I agree. We could make up our own rules to cover all situations. And we/do/have our own rules: we have developed a convention whereby we do not invent our own compounds, and any genitive nouns get a space before their head nouns; only Okrand can invent compounds. It's not always consistent with what Okrand has done, but as you AND Okrand both admit, Okrand himself hasn't been consistent.
Great that we agree. There doesn't seem to be any dispute between us anymore.
maj! I'm glad we can agree that the convention to distinguish between compound nouns and noun-noun constructions with punctuation is a reasonable one. -- SuStel http://trimboli.name