[tlhIngan Hol] *-moH* with verbs of state / quality

Will Martin willmartin2 at mac.com
Wed Nov 17 09:48:01 PST 2021

I’m curious about how one would describe someone washing dishes carelessly enough to not check to make sure they actually are clean when done. They go through the motions of washing them, but it’s hit or miss as to whether or not the dishes are cleaned.

{Say’Ha’moH} implies that the dishes were clean and he made them not clean, un-cleaning them, or miscleaning them. But it’s hit or miss. Some dishes come out clean. Some don’t. {Say’moHbe’} implies not going through the motions of washing.

{Say’moHlaw’} probably comes closest, or {Say’moHchu’be’}. Then again, in English, there isn’t an efficient way of describing this, either. I guess one needs to just describe the action beyond a simple, well-formed verb. {Say’moHlaw’ ‘ach Say’moHchu’be’}.

Other ideas?

> On Nov 17, 2021, at 10:08 AM, SuStel <sustel at trimboli.name> wrote:
> On 11/17/2021 9:49 AM, luis.chaparro at web.de <mailto:luis.chaparro at web.de> wrote:
>> Thanks again to both of you for the detailed discussion! I will try to summerize it (for beginners like me :-) Please tell me if I'm right:
>> 1. We can use *-moH* or *-choHmoH* depending on wether we want to express or focus on the end result (*-moH*) or the change (*-choHmoH*) someone or something is causing.
> I wasn't stating a general rule; I was analyzing a specific sentence. Not all verbs will see a difference between an end result or a change. For instance, if I say tlhIngan Hol vIghojmoH I teach Klingon, I'm not focusing on an end result; I am just talking about an existing action. If I say tlhIngan Hol vIghojchoHmoH I start teaching Klingon, I am talking about the beginning of an action.
> Don't look for a formulaic interpretation of combinations of suffixes. Analyze each verb as you find it.
>>  If someone wants to cook and her / his hands are really dirty, I'll probably be interested on emphasize that I want her / his hands to *become* clean, so I'll likely use *-choHmoH*. If I just recommend someone to be *generally* clean, I'll likely use *-moH*.
> Or if you want to recommend someone maintain a regular cleaning regimen (Hoch jaj nuHlIj yISay'moH Clean your weapon every day). Or if you just want to explain how something becomes clean without describing the transition of going from dirty to clean (raS DaSay'moHmeH, taSvam yIlo' Use this solution to clean the table). There are lots of uses for -moH with or without -choH, and you have to figure them out as needed. Don't try to come up with a simple formula to follow.
> -- 
> SuStel
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