[tlhIngan Hol] Joining two questions with {pagh}

Will Martin willmartin2 at mac.com
Tue Jan 29 07:20:34 PST 2019


[As always, it’s okay to skip long messages like this one. Read only if you find it entertaining. I’m not offended by being skipped.]

I deeply respect the loyalty that others have shown the group; loyalty that I abandoned when I left. I enjoyed being one of the contributors to the foundation of the group, but foundations don’t keep the rain off your head. Those of you who have provided the roof with your continued dedication deserve more respect and appreciation than I do.

I’m not here to shake things up or make it different. I don’t want to cause stress to those who have memories of past conflicts. I just want to join in the common mission to gain skill in the language and have some fun while we’re at it. The main skill I have to offer is that I’m uncommonly good at figuring out how to express ideas and thoughts and feelings with unusual clarity with the limited tool set of a very conservative interpretation of allowed Klingon grammar.

In the past, I have attempted to passionately enforce that conservative interpretation, not budging an inch until Okrand, himself, says it’s okay to loosen up about things. I’m not that guy anymore. The language is yours and his. I’m just one of the users, tagging along. 

For those who don’t know me, I would suggest looking at the Wiki, but to be honest, I think Klingonists are among the most interesting people I’ve ever met, and the bios there are, shall we say, not as interesting as the people they attempt to describe. I’m sure I somehow contributed toward that. Perhaps it is completely my fault. I don’t remember. I’m old. That happens a lot.

Here’s my current version of my bio, and I highly recommend that others who deserve better bios than they have in the Wiki (a.k.a. everybody there) consider spicing things up a bit with a more interesting bio. I’m not posting it directly to the Wiki because I don’t want to shove an egotistically rude change to the way things are there. I offer it here so that people can decide whether or not we should all change the bios to be more like this, giving new people a better idea of the peculiar version of fun that we have here, or maybe it sucks and should never be allowed on the wiki. [wave hand soothingly] "Move along. These are not the words you are looking for":

One of the 12 attendees of qep’a’ wa’DIch; one of six attending for the entire contiguous week.
One of the third wave of beings capable of Klingon speech. (Wave 1: HoD Qanqor at the Klingon Camp that he and Seqram attended a year before qep’a’ wa’DIch. Wave 2: HoD Qanqor and Seqram at qep’a’ wa’DIch. Wave 3: those at qep’a’ cha’DIch, having spent the past year acting on the inspiration of qep’a’ wa’DIch.)
One of the Beginners’ Grammarians.
Author of the AKD (Annotated Klingon Dictionary), the first collection of all Klingon words from all canon sources with sources sited. Others had word lists, but no one else had thought of siting sources before, so this was a useful new resource for resolving arguments about vocabulary. Marc Okrand asked for a copy during one of the qep’a'mey, since at that time, he did not have a single, alphabetized in English or Klingon, list of his own words from all sources, with notes on inconsistencies between E->K and K->E sides of TKD.
Came up with the idea that became the New Words List on KLI’s Web site and maintained it for more than a decade (currently maintained by ghunchu’wI’), with much technical assistance from Seqram.
Sang bass in the Klingon Quartet organized by HoD Qanqor.
Attended the first ten qep’a’mey.
While never achieving the ready vocabulary and conversational skills of Qov, ghuyDo wa’, HoD Qanqor, nIchyon, and others with such natural talent, doggedly worked to achieve a deep understanding of the grammar, and fought persistently to preserve the language’s grammar and vocabulary in the form Okrand invented and developed, stressing the difference between encoding English vs. translating into Klingon. Example: Klingon lacks a question word for “which”, as in, “Which weapon do you want?” Others tried to spread the idea that {nuq nuH DaneH?} would suffice, since as encoded English it could be interpreted as “What weapon do you want?”, though it literally means something like “You want the weapon of what?” as in perhaps “the scabbard’s weapon” or “the holster’s weapon”, or “the weapon of the box Carol Merril is carrying”. Far better to go back to the pre-lingual thought that was expressed in English as “Which weapon do you want?” and express it in Klingon as {nuHlIj yIwIv!} (Choose your weapon!).
Interviewed Okrand for HolQeD, helping to clarify points of grammar with journalistic integrity, touching unresolved topics previously discussed on the Email list, intentionally avoiding wording that might influence Okrand’s explanations.
One of the matlh jupna’pu’, granted the various Klingon words for “top” and “bottom”, and related terms.
Stopped participating in the KLI after marrying someone disinterested in the language, and tiring of the years of arguing with those trying to add non-canon words or non-canon interpretations of grammar to common practice among Klingonists, and finally, discovering that the flip side of his love for the beauty of Klingon grammar is that he absolutely despises Okrand’s decisions about how to handle ditransitive verbs with {-moH}. Passion is passion. It’s not always pretty.
I’m sure that would never pass guidelines for the Wiki, and probably will upset people, but come on, guys. Show some of the delightful sense of humor that has always arisen at qep’a’mey. Our bios should make us laugh, while respecting the truth, therein. We have accomplished many great, silly things.

The “Who’s on first?” skit deserves a spot in the Wiki bio for both participants. It was BRILLIANT.

Note that I did not list “Contributing editor of The Klingon Hamlet”. My name is on the title page, because I did start off in that role, but the author didn’t accept any of my edits. None. Zero. Seqram managed the diplomatic task of editing better than I did. They were kind to me to put my name on the title page so I could show friends for a brief moment of geek fame, but of course I’d feel guilty about it because I don’t deserve the credit I was given. It compensates for the credit I probably didn’t get for other stuff, but then, hey, I don’t remember what that stuff might have been, either, so what difference does it make, really?

qatlh jIchegh? (Maybe I should rename myself {cheghwI’})

qaStaHvIS wejmaH DIS, wa' Huch vISuqmeH Qu’ vIghaj. DuSaQ’a’Daq, De’wI’mey (Macs and PCs) lo’bogh nuvpu’’e’ vIQaH. Qu’vam vISuqchoHDI’, DuSaQ’a’ malja’ leHlu’meH, “administrative assistants” neH vItoy’. roD yaHchaj vISuch.

choH QurwI’. latlh pIn vISuq. ghojwI’pu’, ghojmoHwI’’a'pu’, “administrative assistants” je vItoy’, ‘ach not yaHchaj vISuch. ghoghHablI’ QInmey je neH vIlo’choHlaH.

choHqa’ QurwI’. latlh pIn vISuq. ghojwI’pu’ vItoy’ ‘e’ vImev. yaHmey vISuchqa’laH.

choHqa’ QurwI’. DaH Hoch Hol ghojmoHwI’’a’pu’ “administrative assistants” je vItoy’.

roD vIQaHtaHvIS, ‘amerIqa’ngan Hol wIlo’, ‘ach wa’ Hol ghojmoHwI’’a’pu’ ‘amerIqa’ngan Hol lo’laHbe’: ‘amerIqa’ngan ghop Hol ghojmoHwI’’a’pu'. muQoylaHbe’. muja’laHbe’. jatlhlaHbe’. Qoy’eghlaHbe’mo’, ghoghchaj lo’laHbe’. vaj mughwI’ wIpoQ pagh QIt nuQchu'bogh QInHommey law' wIlo’nIS.

ghu’vam vIDublaH ‘e’ vIwuq. ‘amerIqa’ngan ghop Hol vIghoj’lI’.

vaj Hol vIqelqa’qu’. vaj tlhIngan Hol vIqelqa’. vaj jIchegh.

SKI: chargwhI’ rattles on about how he came to decide to rejoin the list after all these years.

charghwI’ ‘utlh



> On Jan 28, 2019, at 9:50 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> charghwI' 'utlh:
>> If you want to convey ambivalence, then just say so: {Sojvam vIpar ‘e’ vISIv.}
> 
> I like this idea; I like it a lot.
> 
> Other than that..
> 
> charghwI', naDev Dacheghta' 'ej bIghItlhqa'ta', jIbel !
> charghwI', I'm happy to be reading from you again !
> 
> qaStaHvIS poH vorgh, naDev bIghItlhbe'taHmo', jI'IQ.
> I missed you.
> 
> ~ mayqel *I love maltz* qunen'oS
> _______________________________________________
> tlhIngan-Hol mailing list
> tlhIngan-Hol at lists.kli.org
> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org

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