Hi, I remember a discussion and an explanation about using {-Ha'} vs. {-be'}, or am I wrong? Was it ever explained? Why is it {yIH lI'be'} instead of {yIH lI'Ha'}? I think I vaguely remember seing an answer to this, but I just can't find it. -- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" http://www.tlhInganHol.com http://klingon.wiki/En/Rover
I found two posts by SuStel re the slang phrase {Duj ngaDHa'} "person who is wildly irresponsible, out of control, undisciplined" : (SuStel 9/1997): It's official: we can use {-Ha'} on adjectival verbs. Yes, it's in a slang expression, but Okrand says nothing about this being nonstandard grammar (he's very careful about that sort of thing all through the slang section). (SuStel, 10/2011): {Duj ngaDHa'} in KGT was also the first time we saw { -Ha'} on an adjectivally acting verb. Prior to that we'd only seen {-qu'} in TKD ({veng tInqu'Daq} "in the big city") and {-be'} in CK ({wa'maH yIHmey lI'be'} "ten useless tribbles"). See also {'eyHa'} "be undelicious, poor-tasting" : (KGT 84): All food is considered to be good in its natural state; it takes the intervention of a cook to ruin it. Thus, the word {'eyHa'}, used to describe food that is edible but is not particularly tasty, means something like "undelicious", implying that someone caused it to cease being delicious. Voragh ------------------------------Original Message------------------------------ From: Lieven L. Litaer via tlhIngan-Hol I remember a discussion and an explanation about using {-Ha'} vs. {-be'}, or am I wrong? Was it ever explained? Why is it {yIH lI'be'} instead of {yIH lI'Ha'}? I think I vaguely remember seing an answer to this, but I just can't find it.
While the answer is historically accurate, I’m not sure it addresses the question. {yIH lI’be’} or “useless tribbles” are tribbles that are not useful. It’s a simple negation. *yIH lI’Ha’* would be something like misuseful tribbles (like maybe someone thought they’d be good candidates to guard a shipment of quadrotriticalli), or unuseful tribbles, as if somehow the tribbles were reversed from the state of having been useful through some prior event or process, like, I don’t know, maybe they became stale? In any case *yIHmey lI’Ha’* would be highly unusual tribbles, and I’d need to hear the story behind how they got that way. pItlh charghwI’ ‘utlh (ghaH, ghaH, -Daj)
On Nov 2, 2023, at 10:03 AM, Lieven L. Litaer via tlhIngan-Hol <tlhingan-hol@lists.kli.org> wrote:
Hi,
I remember a discussion and an explanation about using {-Ha'} vs. {-be'}, or am I wrong? Was it ever explained?
Why is it {yIH lI'be'} instead of {yIH lI'Ha'}?
I think I vaguely remember seing an answer to this, but I just can't find it.
-- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" http://www.tlhInganHol.com http://klingon.wiki/En/Rover _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
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Lieven L. Litaer -
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Will Martin