Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ? qunnoq On Sep 14, 2017 5:53 PM, "nIqolay Q" <niqolay0@gmail.com> wrote: On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 10:35 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
It is ridiculous, and that's an understatement, that the mighty "warrior's language", doesn't have a word for "spoils".
How do you know it doesn't? Do you have your own Maltz living in your basement? It's true that there is no word that means "spoils" *that we know of yet*. All that means is that Marc Okrand hasn't gotten around to asking Maltz about it. It doesn't necessarily say anything at all about Klingon culture. There was no word for "bridge" (as in the kind that goes over a river) until 2012. Does that mean Klingons didn't discover bridges until then? We don't yet know the Klingon expression for a "Heisenberg compensator" (an integral part of transporter technology), yet Klingons manage to transport themselves all over just fine. _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon. It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid.
On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com <mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon.
It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid.
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for /spoils,/" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for /spoils,/ don't they?" -- SuStel http://trimboli.name
SuStel:
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post > to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for *spoils,*" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for *spoils,* don't they?"
'o SuStel jupwI' le' ! reH choyajchu' ! hahaha qunnoq On Sep 14, 2017 6:41 PM, "SuStel" <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:
On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon.
It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid.
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for *spoils,*" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for *spoils,* don't they?"
-- SuStelhttp://trimboli.name
_______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:40 AM, SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:
On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon.
It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid.
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for *spoils,*" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for *spoils,* don't they?"
*toH! mayqel, nom jIghoH, 'ach QIt jIyaj. *I've certainly made similar arguments before about words we don't know yet.* veS tev* (I suppose it would be *noH tev* if you're talking about specific spoils from a specific war) strikes me as a particularly good phrase.
*nIqolay Q:* *> toH! mayqel, nom jIghoH, 'ach QIt jIyaj.* qay'be', nIqolay Q ! naDev, juppu' maH. pIj, qa' DI'onmey le' ghajmo' Hoch nuv, chaq wa' yajHa'laH latlh. 'a mavuvchuqbejmo', tagha', not qay'wI' tu'lu'. No problem nIqolay Q ! We're all friends here. Often, because of the unique character traits of each person, perhaps one can misunderstand the other. But since we definitely respect each other, at the end there is never a problem. qunnoq On Sep 14, 2017 6:56 PM, "nIqolay Q" <niqolay0@gmail.com> wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:40 AM, SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:
On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon.
It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid.
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for *spoils,*" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for *spoils,* don't they?"
*toH! mayqel, nom jIghoH, 'ach QIt jIyaj. *I've certainly made similar arguments before about words we don't know yet.* veS tev* (I suppose it would be *noH tev* if you're talking about specific spoils from a specific war) strikes me as a particularly good phrase.
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I'm thinking <pop> (or <veS popmey>) might work. In paq'batlh, Kahless says to Morath (on the subject of a targ that Kahless slew): loDnI'wI' bIHoHta'be' popwIj 'oH nach [sic] juHDaq porgh Daqem My brother you failed to kill, The head is my reward, You bring the carcass home. So, here <pop> is used in the sense of a reward that is claimed, rather than one that is willingly given. Whether or not this usage is metaphorical, I cannot say. //loghaD 14 sep. 2017 kl. 17:41 skrev SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name<mailto:sustel@trimboli.name>>: On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote: On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com<mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote: Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ? If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon. It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid. You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for spoils," but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for spoils, don't they?" -- SuStel http://trimboli.name _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org<mailto:tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
popwIj 'oH nach
Isn't here an {-'e'} on {nach} missing ? qunnoq On Sep 14, 2017 8:53 PM, "Felix Malmenbeck" <felixm@kth.se> wrote:
I'm thinking «pop» (or «veS popmey») might work. In paq'batlh, Kahless says to Morath (on the subject of a targ that Kahless slew):
loDnI'wI' bIHoHta'be' popwIj 'oH nach [sic] juHDaq porgh Daqem
My brother you failed to kill, The head is my reward, You bring the carcass home.
So, here «pop» is used in the sense of a reward that is claimed, rather than one that is willingly given. Whether or not this usage is metaphorical, I cannot say.
//loghaD
14 sep. 2017 kl. 17:41 skrev SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name>:
On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote:
On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com> wrote:
Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ?
If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon.
It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid.
You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for *spoils,*" but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for *spoils,* don't they?"
-- SuStelhttp://trimboli.name
_______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
_______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
Presumably, yes, hence the "[sic]"; this means that there is an error in the quoted material :) //loghaD 14 sep. 2017 kl. 19:57 skrev mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com<mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>>:
popwIj 'oH nach
Isn't here an {-'e'} on {nach} missing ? qunnoq On Sep 14, 2017 8:53 PM, "Felix Malmenbeck" <felixm@kth.se<mailto:felixm@kth.se>> wrote: I'm thinking <pop> (or <veS popmey>) might work. In paq'batlh, Kahless says to Morath (on the subject of a targ that Kahless slew): loDnI'wI' bIHoHta'be' popwIj 'oH nach [sic] juHDaq porgh Daqem My brother you failed to kill, The head is my reward, You bring the carcass home. So, here <pop> is used in the sense of a reward that is claimed, rather than one that is willingly given. Whether or not this usage is metaphorical, I cannot say. //loghaD 14 sep. 2017 kl. 17:41 skrev SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name<mailto:sustel@trimboli.name>>: On 9/14/2017 11:27 AM, nIqolay Q wrote: On Thu, Sep 14, 2017 at 11:00 AM, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun@gmail.com<mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com>> wrote: Are you serious ? Do you really expect this kind of arguments to be taken seriously ? If you're going to be "in-character" and treat Klingon culture as if it's a real thing, then you also have to treat the Klingon language as something we only know about from the incomplete information told to us by a single grouchy Klingon. It's one thing to wonder in-character why no one's ever asked Maltz about spoils or why Maltz has never brought them up, but acting like there is some major deficiency in the depiction of Klingon culture simply because Marc Okrand hasn't worked his way through every entry in Merriam-Webster strikes me as incredibly stupid. You have to learn to speak mayqel-ese. I took his initial post to mean, not "Klingon culture and language is stupid because they don't have a word for spoils," but "Klingons obviously have to have a word for spoils, don't they?" -- SuStel http://trimboli.name _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org<mailto:tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org<mailto:tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org _______________________________________________ tlhIngan-Hol mailing list tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org<mailto:tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
I believe {tev} is the right word for this. In John Ford's novel "The Final Reflection", there is the equivalent of a Klingon television series named "Battlecruiser Vengeance". Memory Beta gives an introductory summary of the show: It featured the adventures of Klingon Captain Koth of the Vengeance, in
conflict with alien races such as Humans, Romulans and Kinshaya and others, and trying to capture their ships. Koth was always triumphant, and each episode ended with him being asked who he was by those he had captured, and answering "I am Captain Koth. Koth of the Vengeance. And this ship is my prize."
[A bad translation into Klingon follows. It is of no value.] {'ej tevwIj 'oH Dujvam'e'} sounds perfect to me. -- ghunchu'wI'
“Battlecruiser Vengeance” had its reflection (!) on our television screens as well. The IKC Bortas, a Vor'cha-class attack cruiser, conveyed Captain Picard's request for Klingon assistance at Nelvana III when the Enterprise-D investigated reports of a secret Romulan base. (TNG "The Defector") The Bortas later served as Gowron's flagship during the Klingon civil war of 2367-68 and Worf served as weapons officer aboard her during the early part of that conflict. (TNG "Redemption I") And two centuries earlier the Klingon ship Vor’Tas, under the command of a Captain Duras, was crippled by the Enterprise in 2152. Captain Archer was captured and put on trial on the Narendra III outpost for conspiring against the Klingon Empire and fomenting revolt. (ENT "Judgment") -- Voragh From: Alan Anderson In John Ford's novel "The Final Reflection", there is the equivalent of a Klingon television series named "Battlecruiser Vengeance". Memory Beta gives an introductory summary of the show: It featured the adventures of Klingon Captain Koth of the Vengeance, in conflict with alien races such as Humans, Romulans and Kinshaya and others, and trying to capture their ships. Koth was always triumphant, and each episode ended with him being asked who he was by those he had captured, and answering "I am Captain Koth. Koth of the Vengeance. And this ship is my prize." [A bad translation into Klingon follows. It is of no value.] {'ej tevwIj 'oH Dujvam'e'} sounds perfect to me. -- ghunchu'wI'
participants (6)
-
Alan Anderson -
Felix Malmenbeck -
mayqel qunenoS -
nIqolay Q -
Steven Boozer -
SuStel