I am currntly working on a kind of exercise book. THe german version has been published, the English version will appear soon, but not before the qep'a'. The contents of the story is a young woman going to a convention. She gets to a situation the get an actor give an autograph. I learned from Maltz that one does not use {qI'} (sign a treaty) for that. Instead, use {tlhI'} "sign, autograph" (verb and noun) Quote from Marc Okrand: ------------------- {qI’} is a verb meaning “sign” as when signing a treaty, contract, loan agreement, etc. It also means “register for” or “sign up for,” typically used in reference to accounts (online or otherwise) but it’s also used for signing up for a conference or class or even for auditions for a team or show. What underlies this is that something — an obligation or commitment or pact or response or arrangement of some sort — comes about as a result of the signing (or signing up). {qI’} can also be used for signing a petition. In this case, the signer hopes for an action or response on the part of the recipient of the petition, knowing, however, that it may not come to pass. What might come about as a result of the signing is potential. The signing (or signing up) need not be done by putting pen to paper or the like. It can be electronic (e-signing) or anything else that is recognized by the parties involved. {qI’} is still the verb used for this. The object of {qI’} is the document (actual or electronic or whatever) that the “signature” ends up on or associated with, thereby becoming documentation of the commitment. When one signs an autograph, there is no commitment or reponse involved. A celebrity’s signature on a photo, for example, implies no expectation that the celebrity (or anyone else) will or might do anything. Accordingly, {qI’} is not appropriate here. The verb used for signing an autograph is {tlhI’}. This is also the verb to use for artists signing their works. This action involves making a mark of some kind that is associated specifically with the mark maker. This mark could be (and maybe usually is) the name of the signer (that is, a signature) made in a distinctive way that only the signer uses, perhaps in a form difficult to decipher by those unfamiliar with what it is. As with {qI’}, the object of {tlhI’} is the document (or photo, work of art, etc.) that the signature is applied to. There is also a noun {tlhI’} that might best be translated as “signature.” (It is not grammatical to say {tlhI’ tlhI’} “sign a signature”; the verb {tlhI'} already includes the notion that the resulting mark is a {tlhI’}. Well, {tlhI’ tlhI’} could be used, I suppose, if one were to sign on top of an already-existing {tlhI’}.) {bItlhI’ vIneH}, literally something like “I want you to sign,” would be understood to mean “I want your autograph.” (Similarly: {paqwIj DatlhI’ vIneH} would be understood to mean “I want you to autograph my book.”) Interestingly, {tlhI’} (both the noun and the verb) may also refer to what an animal does to mark its territory. To write (or make marks) in general is, of course {ghItlh}. ------------------- -- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" https://tlhInganHol.com https://klingon.wiki/En/KlingonAtConventions
Lieven, I was off-line from February 22 to July 1st. My email account was locked, so I didn't have access to any posts from the tlhIngan-Hol list (they weren't kept on the server). Did you - or anyone else (De'vID?) - post other revelations from Maltz like this one on {qI'] vs. {tlhI'}? With qep'a' 31 imminent I'd like to update my notes with anything you may have shared during my absence. Do you have a web page where you temporarily archive similar posts and discussions with Okrand before updating the various new lists and pages that you maintain? E.g. https://www.kli.org/about-klingon/new-klingon-words/ which is marked with a disclaimer: This list is not current. It was last updated with words revealed in the middle of 2020. It will be brought up to match present knowledge by July 2024. I'm anxious to jump back into the discussions. Thanks, Steven ("Voragh") P.S. What's the name of that exercise book you're working on? ----------------------------------------Original Message--------------------------------------------- From: tlhIngan-Hol <tlhingan-hol-bounces@lists.kli.org> On Behalf Of Lieven L. Litaer via tlhIngan-Hol Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2024 12:06 AM I am currently working on a kind of exercise book. The German version has been published, the English version will appear soon, but not before the qep'a'. The contents of the story is a young woman going to a convention. She gets to a situation the get an actor give an autograph. I learned from Maltz that one does not use {qI'} (sign a treaty) for that. Instead, use {tlhI'} "sign, autograph" (verb and noun) Quote from Marc Okrand: [ snip ] -------------------
Steven Boozer wrote Tuesday, July 23, 2024 9:41 AM: << P.S. What's the name of that exercise book you're working on? It's "Klingon at Conventions' / "Klingonisch auf Conventions". (I guess KAC for those of us who like abbreviation!.) I should have looked more closely at Lieven's signature for the URL: < Lieven L. Litaer < aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" < https://tlhInganHol.com < https://klingon.wiki/En/KlingonAtConventions -- Voragh
Hi Steven, I did not send anything new besides that, and I don't remember others. I do not really have an archive of such mails, but sometimes I archive important messages here: https://www.qephom.de/e/message_from_maltz.html To stay updated, I suggest you look at my Klingon Language Wiki, which is usually very up to date. Best way is to start here: https://klingon.wiki/En/NewWords Also, find the full word list here: https://klingon.wiki/Word/Contents I'll try to make an automatic list with "latest additions" or so. My book is entitled "Klingon at Conventions". You can read about it on the wiki: https://klingon.wiki/En/KlingonAtConventions Hope this helps. -- Lieven L. Litaer aka the "Klingon Teacher from Germany" https://tlhInganHol.com
On 7/25/2024 8:36 AM, Lieven L. Litaer via tlhIngan-Hol wrote:
I did not send anything new besides that, and I don't remember others.
There were no other Okrandian revelations in that time period. -- SuStel http://trimboli.name
participants (3)
-
Lieven L. Litaer -
Steven Boozer -
SuStel