From: "ghunchu'wI' 'utlh" <qunchuy@alcaco.net>

On Oct 13, 2017, at 4:23 PM, SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:
 
On 10/13/2017 2:55 PM, ghunchu'wI' 'utlh wrote:
On Oct 13, 2017, at 12:26 PM, SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:
I wouldn’t make that assumption. If you must quote a cat, say: ghugh vIghro’; jatlh ‘Imyagh.

I think that contradicts the “not speech” part of {ghugh}’s definition. It makes perfect sense in my mind to treat {ghugh} as similar to {jatlh}.

If it's not speech, then it's not a verb of saying.

What is your definition of “verb of saying”, and who called {ghugh} one?
 
 
I should have "verb of speech," because that's what Okrand called it in his interview with Will Martin in HolQeD 7:4. His first statement is "Verbs of speech are 'say' verbs, like jatlh and ja'." Then he says that, unlike the English tendency to attach any old verb to a quotation, Klingon doesn't do that:
 
In English, we say, "Give me some water," he said. "Give me some water," he pleaded. "Give me some water," he yelled. [...] I think that's an English thing to do. That's not a Klingon thing to do. In Klingon, you jatlh and you ja'. That's about it. The guard asked the prisoner a question. He replied. He said, "[gestures a quotation he never quite made]"
 
He later admits that there may be other verbs of speech, but that they're few. "The way I see I see the verbs of speech, there may be more than just ja' and jatlh, but there is only a small number of words, unlike English."
 
And the bulk of this section of the article is Okrand explaining to Martin that verbs of speech in the 'e'-less sentence-as-object construction are used to report direct quotations.
 
So does that mean ghugh might also be a verb of speech? Yeeeesssss, if you ignore that ghugh is explicitly not speech. If you consider "verbs of quotation" to be a better term to describe them, you still need to demonstrate that ghugh is not among all the other words that Okrand explicitly blocked from being verbs of speech, mostly giving their English translations: tlhob, qoy', jach, chel, jang, and that it is one of the few that Okrand wasn't even sure existed.
 
So all of that is a lot of guesswork and looking at things sideways to get to ghugh being a verb of speech, which is why I said "I wouldn't make that assumption" and not "You can't do that." Hey, it DOES sound like ghugh could be the "verb of animal noises" equivalent to "verbs of speech," but we don't KNOW that.
 
As for who called ghugh a verb of speech: loghaD did, just not with that term:
 
I would assume that this word can be used similarly to jatlh:

ghugh vIghro' 'Imyagh.
'Imyagh, ghugh vIghro'.
"The v'gro goes 'Imyagh."
He's talking about verbs of speech. He assumed; I said I wouldn't make that assumption.