Am 11.04.2019 um 11:28 schrieb De'vID:
latter is perfectly clear. While Okrand's examples are brief, they were
clearly chosen to disambiguate whether actual contact is included in the
meaning of {SIch}.
Okrand wrote:
The intended meaning is (b), as in {paqvetlh DaSIchlaH'a'?} —
maybe the book's on a high shelf. Or {paq vISIch 'e' vInID}, which could
be translated "I reached for the book. The (a) meaning is covered by {paw}."
Okay, I got the point with {paw}, no discussion. But the question
{paqvetlh DaSIchlaH'a'} asks whether the goal can be achieved, right? If
{SIch} means only "reach for" in the sense of stretching your arm, then
it does not include the touching. I can reach for the stars, but surely
won't touch them.
SIch doesn't mean reach for; it means reach. The reach for interpretation only works for his example paq vISIch 'e' vInID; it's the 'e' vInID that makes the accomplishment uncertain, the reach for. If you just said paq vISIch, you're saying you stretch out your hand and grasp the book.
The correct sense of reach in the Dictionary.com definition is number 3: "to succeed in touching or seizing with an outstretched hand, a pole, etc." This is what Okrand describes SIch as meaning. It's not clear to me whether it could also mean sense 5: "to stretch or extend so as to touch or meet"; can we say 'aqroS SIch yorghmey The bookcase reaches the ceiling?
Hovmey vISIch 'e' vInID I reach for the stars;
literally I try to reach the stars. This would only be
interpreted literally; the English idiom meaning achieve the
highest goal isn't expressed. It says I'm stretching out my
hand in a (vain) attempt to grasp the stars.
So if {SIch} includes the touching, the answer to {DaSIchlaH'a'} is only
'yes' if I can touch. If {SIch} is only the movement
("reach-for-stars"), then the answer is always 'yes', unless my arm is
broken. But if {SIch} includes both possibilities, both answers 'yes'
and 'no' are always correct: I can always reach for something, even if I
cannot reach it.
SIch includes the touching. The answer is only yes.
vItlhap I take it.
vItlhap 'e' vInID I try to take it. I take some
kind of action to enable myself to take it.
Same relationship.
-- SuStel http://trimboli.name