On Tuesday 21 Mar 2017 14:41:47 SuStel wrote:

> On 3/21/2017 1:56 PM, Jeremy Silver wrote:

> > I too have been having trouble finding a good way to express sand and

> > ash and bribe for example. I think describing ground-up rock confuses

> > people if trying to talk about sand.

>

> Hmm. *nagh pullu'pu'bogh* is actually a pretty decent substitute for

> /sand./

>

True, but it's also an overly complicated term to use for poetic or lyrical use.

 

*rIy'o'* 'oH be' pong'e'. 'ej naghDaq pullu'pu'bogh mI' ghaH.

Depends on how you use it. If you're trying to fill the same single syllable as sand, then yes, it's clumsy.

> Don't think so, though something about that is nagging me. I'm also

> thinking you might do something with *Don* and maybe *vel**,* but it's

> clumsy.

>

As parallel things don't cross, would that be something based on {DonHa'} or the like?

Of course. DonHa' has Don in it. I wasn't spelling out how it might be used.

> > Do we have a usual way of expressing the concept of "beyond" like:

> > On the other side of the mountain, there is a prison kind of thing?

> >

> > or Past the crossroads someone did something?

>

> *HuD latlh Dop retlhDaq bIghHa' tu'lu'*/in the area next to the

> mountain's other side there is a prison./ But that doesn't cover phrases

> like /far over the Misty Mountains cold,/ where the thing you're talking

> about isn't immediately next to the other side of the mountain. You

> might play with something like *pa' Hop* /faraway thereabouts. /This

> starts to run into "sometimes inaccurate but never approximate" territory.

 

Thanks for the response and identifying the reference. Why do I get the feeling I'm not the only one to try translating that poem?

I haven't tried that one, but I've done a lot of other Tolkien on this list. I've gone more for the Anglo-Saxon-esque poetry and the dramatic scenes.

-- 
SuStel
http://trimboli.name