voragh:
> However, the {'e' -lu'} pattern can indeed be used with verbs 
> other than {‘aq}.

This is new to me. I can't understand why on these examples the {'e' -lu'} pattern is used, but I do remember that on numerous occasions on this list, we have said (or I have been told) that it is not permissible.

Do the examples that you posted, mean that we can freely use {'e' -lu'} ?

As far as the {-lu' net} is concerned, I see no problem with it since it doesn't contradict any rule.

~ nI'ghma

On Nov 30, 2017 10:00 PM, "Steven Boozer" <sboozer@uchicago.edu> wrote:

From: mayqel qunenoS
>> {'e' -lu'} is not a permissible construction, unless the {-lu'} is on the verb {'aq}.

 

  SIS 'e' 'aqlu', javmaH vatlhvI' DIch
  It is predicted it will rain, 60% certainty. (qep'a' 2017)

 

However, the {'e' -lu'} pattern can indeed be used with verbs other than {‘aq}.  E.g.

 

  Qang QanmeH yan 'ISletlh Damuv 'e' wIvlu'.
  You are chosen to serve on the Yan-Isleth and protect the chancellor. MKE

 

We’ve also seen the pattern {-lu' 'e' -lu'} used:

 

  yay chavlu' 'e' bajnISlu'

  Victory must be earned. TKW

  yInlu'taH 'e' bajnISlu'
  Survival must be earned. TKW

  DIvI' rojmab qep ghanglu' 'e' nIDlu', 'ach taH qep.
  Despite efforts to halt them, peace talks with Federation continue. MKE

And we’ve even seen the pattern {-lu' net}:

 

  vImuHlu' net wuqHa'!
  My death sentence was commuted! (ENT "Affliction")

--
Voragh

 

From: mayqel qunenoS

{'e' -lu'} is not a permissible construction, unless the {-lu'} is on the verb {'aq}.

 

Always, as soon as you find yourself wanting to say {yadda yadda 'e' *whatever*lu'} you should instead write {yadda yadda net whatever}

 

~ nI'ghma

 

On Nov 30, 2017 9:12 PM, "Aurélie Demonchaux" <demonchaux.aurelie@gmail.com> wrote:

Today I am trying to grasp the difference between {net + verb} and {'e' + verb-lu'}

 

The way I understand it is, for example with "Sov"

 

net Sov = it is common knowledge that 

'e' Sovlu' = someone (indefinite) knows that

 

Thus:

qama'pu' DIHoHbe' net Sov = It is common knowledge that we don't kill prisoners

qama'pu' DIHoHbe' 'e' Sovlu' = It is known / someone knows that we don't kill prisoners

 

Similarly with chaw' : 

qama'pu' DIHoH net chaw'be' = we are not allowed to kill prisoners

qama'pu' DIHoH 'e' chaw'lu'be' = someone does not allow us to kill prisoners

 

Am I getting it right ?

 

Thanks in advance!

Aurélie

ghItlhjaj

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