<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class="">[Read this for amusement purposes only.]</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Another way to think of it is that the word order of {-meH} and {-bogh} are figured out by completely different systems. A verb with {-meH} always precedes the noun or verb it modifies, and the verb with {-meH} paired with its noun grammatically become a noun phrase in a larger grammatical structure. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">A verb with {-bogh} uses the Head Noun as a subject or object, so the Head Noun could come before or after its verb with {-bogh}, and the entire clause belonging to the verb with {-bogh} including the Head Noun behaves like a noun phrase in a larger grammatical structure.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">So, consider the canon example you offered:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">romuluSngan Sambogh ‘ej HoHbogh nejwI’</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">That’s a noun phrase that would be used in a sentence. What if we were inspired by {ghojmeH taj} and wanted to talk about a boy's version of the Romulan hunter-killer probe?</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">We’d very naturally nest things into:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">romuluSngan Sambogh ‘ej HoHbogh ghojmeH nejwI’</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Now, the {-meH} clause with it’s noun bundled into it is a noun phrase within the noun phrases of the two {-bogh} clauses, within a larger sentence, like:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">vInwI’vaD romuluSngan Sambogh ‘ej HoHbogh ghojmeH nejwI’ vIje’ vIneH.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I want to buy a boy’s Romulan hunter-killer probe for my nephew. [Awwwwwww. How cute. This is the version that hunts people down and stings them; great for practical jokes! It’s non-lethal, unless it annoys them to death.]</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">You wouldn’t want to toss an extra {‘ej} into that because there is no parallel grammatical construction to the {-meH} clause. It would come out something like, “I want to buy a boy’s and Romulan hunter-killer probe.”</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">You don’t want a hunter-killer probe for a boy and a Romulan. You want the boy version of the probe, which is associated with Romulans, and this boy is not a Romulan, so it would be very, VERY wrong to put that {‘ej} in there, even if it were permitted by the grammar, and it isn’t.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">
<meta charset="UTF-8" class=""><div dir="auto" style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div>pItlh</div><div><br class=""></div><div>charghwI’ ‘utlh</div><div>(ghaH, ghaH, -Daj)</div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
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<div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Apr 28, 2022, at 8:14 AM, D qunen'oS <<a href="mailto:mihkoun@gmail.com" class="">mihkoun@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="">SuStel;<br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">Relative clauses and purpose clauses work in entirely different ways for entirely<br class="">different purposes. It's not just a case of saying "Eh, one type 9 suffix is just like every other!"<br class="">In English, there is a formal, but not always observed, rule that when you conjoin words or phrases,<br class="">they should be of like kind, such that one could syntactically substitute for the other without<br class="">change. It's correct to say if I see you and if I recognize you (two conditional clauses), but it's not correct<br class="">to say if I see you and while I am eating (a conditional clause and a while-clause). It's correct to say<br class="">apples and pears (two nouns) but not correct to say apples and happy (a noun and an adjective). And so on.<br class=""></blockquote><br class="">Ok, now I understand, thanks.<br class=""><br class="">I thought it was just a matter of substitution one type-9 with<br class="">another. In fact, thinking of this matter, I realized that in Greek<br class="">too we join words/phrases of the same kind. I just hadn't noticed that<br class="">until now.<br class=""><br class="">-- <br class="">Dana'an<br class=""><a href="https://sacredtextsinklingon.wordpress.com/" class="">https://sacredtextsinklingon.wordpress.com/</a><br class="">Ζεὺς ἦν, Ζεὺς ἐστίν, Ζεὺς ἔσσεται· ὦ μεγάλε Ζεῦ<br class="">_______________________________________________<br class="">tlhIngan-Hol mailing list<br class="">tlhIngan-Hol@lists.kli.org<br class="">http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org<br class=""></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>