<div style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;"><span style="font-family: Arial, "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 0.875rem;">On Tuesday, April 12th, 2022 at 19.27, SuStel <sustel@trimboli.name> wrote:</span></div><div class="protonmail_quote"><br>
<blockquote class="protonmail_quote" type="cite">
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/12/2022 12:14 PM, Iikka Hauhio
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;">SuStel:</div>
<div style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;"><br>
</div>
<blockquote style="border-left: 3px solid rgb(200, 200, 200);
border-top-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); border-right-color:
rgb(200, 200, 200); border-bottom-color: rgb(200, 200, 200);
padding-left: 10px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">
<div style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;"><span style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family:-apple-system,
BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto,
Oxygen-Sans, Ubuntu, Cantarell, "Helvetica Neue",
sans-serif;display:inline !important">Klingon has no suffix
that does this. If I say<span> </span></span><b style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family:-apple-system,
BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto,
Oxygen-Sans, Ubuntu, Cantarell, "Helvetica Neue",
sans-serif">wa'Hu' DungluQ jISoppu',</b><span style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family:-apple-system,
BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto,
Oxygen-Sans, Ubuntu, Cantarell, "Helvetica Neue",
sans-serif;display:inline !important"><span> </span>there is
no built-in connotation that I ate before noon yesterday and
that the eating is relevant to what happened at noon. All
this sentence says is that yesterday at noon, I ate, and
it's being described as a completed whole from a viewpoint
just after the eating stopped. If I say<span> </span></span><b style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family:-apple-system,
BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto,
Oxygen-Sans, Ubuntu, Cantarell, "Helvetica Neue",
sans-serif">wa'leS DungluQ jISoppu',</b><span style="color:rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family:-apple-system,
BlinkMacSystemFont, "Segoe UI", Roboto,
Oxygen-Sans, Ubuntu, Cantarell, "Helvetica Neue",
sans-serif;display:inline !important"><span> </span>I'm
saying that eating will happen tomorrow at noon, and it's
being described as a completed whole from a viewpoint just
after the eating stops.</span><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);"></span><span style="display: inline
!important;"><br>
</span></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial">Yes.</font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial">However, <b>-pu'</b> can
be used to tell that the action has already happened relative
to the "current time of narration".</font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial"><b>jIvem. ram
jISoppu', DaH jISopnISbe'. SIbI' yaHwIj vIghoS.</b></font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial"><i>I wake up. I
ate at night, I don't need to eat now. I go directly to my
workplace.</i></font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial"><b><br>
</b></font></div>
<div style=""><font color="#222222" face="arial">I'm telling a
story using the no-suffix aspect, but in the middle of the
story I describe an event that happened before the current
time of narration using the perfective aspect.</font></div>
</blockquote>
<p>Yes, and you have provided the context yourself, just as I
explained in the next paragraph that you didn't quote. You did
this by starting with a "current time" narrative, then adding a
sentence with an explicit time context in the past prior to the
current time, then returning to the current time with another
explicit time context. You did all this with words that <i>aren't</i>
the verbs whose aspect is being examined. Just as I said.<br>
</p>
<pre cols="72" class="moz-signature">--
SuStel
<a href="http://trimboli.name" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" rel="noreferrer nofollow noopener" target="_blank">http://trimboli.name</a></pre></blockquote><pre cols="72" class="moz-signature"><span style="font-family: arial;">If you remove the perfective aspect, it could mean the following night or habitual night instead of the previous night:</span></pre><pre cols="72" class="moz-signature"><span style="font-family: arial;"><span><font color="#222222" face="arial"><b>jIvem. ram jISop, DaH jISopnISbe'. SIbI' yaHwIj vIghoS.</b></font></span><br><span><font color="#222222" face="arial"><i>I wake up. I eat at night, I don't need to eat now. I go directly to my workplace.</i></font></span><br></span></pre><blockquote class="protonmail_quote" type="cite">
</blockquote>My point is that the perfective aspect is used in this kind of sentences, which might be the source of confusion that causes people to think that <b>-pu'</b> means same as "already".</div><div class="protonmail_quote"><br></div><div class="protonmail_quote">There is even a canon sentence which has the word "already":</div><div class="protonmail_quote"><br></div><div class="protonmail_quote"><b>bIHeghvIpchugh bIHeghpu'.</b></div><div class="protonmail_quote"><i>If you are afraid to die you have already died.</i></div><div class="protonmail_quote"><i><br></i></div><div class="protonmail_quote">It's not a literal translation, but might cause some to think that <b>-pu' </b>= <i>already.</i></div><div class="protonmail_quote"><br></div><div class="protonmail_quote">Iikka "fergusq" Hauhio</div>