<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
</head>
<body>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/7/2022 10:07 AM, Iikka Hauhio
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:dFxCWdYq-7ygZQU9YFhnWrgsFF4om0xkBD46Lw2QIgd_IdvHCSSaSG586hh6XZOJQBxyPWNkx5qWyRGPIM95sjbv3KpdrA2g3JHPfp62U4Q=@protonmail.com">
<div style=""><font face="arial" color="#222222">Through my corpus
search I found these examples:</font></div>
<div style=""><font face="arial" color="#222222"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=""><font face="arial" color="#222222">paq'batlh:</font></div>
<blockquote style="border-left: 3px solid rgb(200, 200, 200);
border-top-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); border-right-color:
rgb(200, 200, 200); border-bottom-color: rgb(200, 200, 200);
padding-left: 10px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">
<div style=""><font face="arial" color="#222222"><b><span>chu'DI'</span></b>
<span>maS</span> <span>'ej</span> <span>qaStaHvIS</span> <span>ram</span></font></div>
<div style=""><font face="arial" color="#222222"><span>nuHmeyDaj</span>
<span>may'luchDaj</span> <span>nIv</span> <span>je</span></font></div>
<div style=""><font face="arial" color="#222222"><span>yIr</span>
<span>qeylIS</span><br>
</font></div>
</blockquote>
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);"></span><font face="arial"
color="#222222"><span><br>
</span></font></div>
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);">TKW:</span></div>
<blockquote style="border-left: 3px solid rgb(200, 200, 200);
border-top-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); border-right-color:
rgb(200, 200, 200); border-bottom-color: rgb(200, 200, 200);
padding-left: 10px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);">wa' Dol nIvDaq <b>matay'DI'</b>
maQap.<br>
</span></div>
</blockquote>
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);"></span><span style=""><br>
</span></div>
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);">PK:</span></div>
<blockquote style="border-left: 3px solid rgb(200, 200, 200);
border-top-color: rgb(200, 200, 200); border-right-color:
rgb(200, 200, 200); border-bottom-color: rgb(200, 200, 200);
padding-left: 10px; color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);"><b>matay'DI'</b>, vIHtaHbogh bIQ
rur mu'qaDmey.<br>
</span></div>
<div style=""><span style="font-family: arial; font-size: 14px;
color: rgb(34, 34, 34);"><span>DopDaq</span> <span>qul</span>
<span>yIchenmoH</span> <b><span>QobDI'</span></b> <span>ghu'</span>.</span></div>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
<p>Good, then it's not impossible. It is sometimes difficult for me
to decide when to use <b>-DI'</b> and when to use <b>-vIS,</b>
and I think the two senses of English <i>when</i> causes that:<i>
when</i> can mean "as soon as," but it can also mean "while." It
might confuse Okrand as well, or he may have had a distinct
interpretation in mind when he chose <b>-DI'</b> for these verbs.</p>
<p>What is, for instance, the difference between <b>DopDaq qul
yIchenmoH QobDI' ghu'</b> s<i>et fire on the side when there is
danger</i> and <b>DopDaq qul yIchenmoH QobtaHvIS ghu'</b><i>
set fire on the side while there is danger?</i> Maybe it's one
of presupposition? The first suggests that, in the event of
danger, one should set fire on the side. The second presupposes
the presence of danger, and one should set fire on the side during
that danger. This is speculation.</p>
<p>The <i>paq'batlh</i> sentence is problematical. <b>chu'DI' maS
'ej qaStaHvIS ram</b><i> when the moon is new and during the
night.</i> The English original is <i>on the night of the new
moon.</i> What made Okrand decide to mix <b>-DI'</b> and <b>-vIS</b>
here? The moon is (presumably) new all night, so it's not like
it's describing the moon <i>becoming</i> new during the night. I
return to wondering whether Okrand was letting his English
influence his choice of Klingon grammar: in English you might say
<i>during a night when the moon was new,</i> but you'd be less
likely to say <i>during a night while the moon was new.</i><br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
SuStel
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://trimboli.name">http://trimboli.name</a></pre>
</body>
</html>