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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 3/30/2022 7:39 AM, mayqel qunen'oS
wrote:<br>
</div>
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cite="mid:CAP7F2cKdTxu6FFObmtfxB-44j6b4CrZRfjZKYPWcmhYsBrW1jA@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="auto">chalqachDaq bIQaDbe' je<br>
even in a tower you are not safe<br>
<br>
I think this sentence shows that the {je} "too" *can* indeed
refer to the type-5'ed noun of the sentence too. I know that the
translation is given as "even.." instead of "at a tower you
aren't safe too", but obviously this is just a matter of choice
of words. The only way I can understand it is "in a tower you
aren't safe too", i.e. "among the various places where you
aren't safe, is a tower too".<br>
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</blockquote>
<p>You are applying the grammar of the English sentence to the
Klingon sentence, but the grammar of the Klingon sentence is
different.</p>
<p>In English, you can move the <i>even</i> around to apply it to
different elements. <i>Even in a tower, you are not safe. In a
tower, even you are not safe. In a tower, you are not even safe.</i></p>
<p>In Klingon, you can't do this. You've either got the adverbial <b>vabDot,</b>
or you've got the leftover <b>je</b> used adverbially, and each
is fixed in position. Klingon can't <i>even</i> individual parts
of a sentence; it can only <i>even</i> entire sentences.<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
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So perhaps it is possible to say:<br>
<br>
ngugh bIpujpu'<br>
DaH bIpuj je<br>
<br>
You were weak then<br>
You're weak now too</div>
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<p>The perfective on the first sentence is wrong. Being weak is a
quality, not an action that is completed. There might be some
unusual situations where being weak can be described as performed
and completed, but this isn't one of them.</p>
<p><b>ngugh bIpuj.<br>
DaH bIpuj je.</b><br>
</p>
<p>The ability to decide which part of the sentence gets the <i>too</i>
in the English translation comes from context. The first sentence
happened <i>at that time;</i> the second sentence happens <i>now.</i>
That's the only thing that changed between the two sentences, so
obviously it's the element that is being <i>too</i>'d. But this
isn't indicated in any way in the grammar of the second sentence.</p>
<p><i>At that time you were weak.<br>
"Now you are weak" is also a true statement.</i><br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
SuStel
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://trimboli.name">http://trimboli.name</a></pre>
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