<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Again, I think it comes down to that Klingon has a verb conjunction {‘ej} and an adverbial {je} that are closely related. There is no adverbial that is closely related to {‘ach}.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">X and Y, too.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">X and not Y, however.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Klingon has the adverbial “too”, but not an adverbial “however”.<br class=""><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Nov 10, 2021, at 1:49 PM, De'vID <<a href="mailto:de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com" class="">de.vid.jonpin@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><br class=""></div><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, 10 Nov 2021 at 15:07, SuStel <<a href="mailto:sustel@trimboli.name" class="">sustel@trimboli.name</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div class="">
<div class="">On 11/10/2021 7:50 AM, mayqel qunen'oS
wrote:<br class="">
</div><p class="">And so on. So I don't think you'd combine <br class="">
</p><p class=""><b class="">yaS luHoHpu'</b><br class="">
and<b class=""><br class="">
'a be' luHoHpu'be' je</b></p><p class="">in this way. Here, you're changing both the object and the verb.</p><p class="">Just say <b class="">yaS luHoHpu' 'a be' luHoHpu'be'</b><i class=""> They killed
the officer but they didn't kill the woman.</i> The <b class="">'a</b><i class="">
but</i> handles the unexpectedness of the woman not also being
killed. If you wanted to emphasize the exception, you could say
something like <b class="">yaS luHoHpu' 'a yIntaHbe' 'e' luchaw'</b><i class="">
They killed the man but they permitted the woman to live.</i></p></div></blockquote></div><div class="">I can see how the example sentence might have come about, though.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Suppose I were to say:</div><div class="">{yaS luHoHpu'. be' luHoHpu' je.} "They killed the officer. They killed the woman also [i.e., they killed the woman, in addition to the officer]."</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Nothing controversial there. Now suppose that I'm reporting back to someone who is expecting me to say the above. Maybe I'm a hostage negotiator and things are going badly, and I leave the building where the terrorists have just killed at least one hostage to report to the police chief. I say:</div><div class="">{yaS luHoHpu'. 'ach be' luHoHpu'be' je.} "They killed the officer. But they didn't kill the woman also [i.e., kill the woman, in addition to the officer]."</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I don't even think the English sentences sound strange here. If you think of it as applying {je} to the negated sentence, then it looks like too many things have changed at once for {je} to be applicable. But I think of the above example as applying the {-be'} to {be' luHoHpu' je}. And I don't think the meaning is quite exactly the same with {'a} but no {je}. There's a difference between "They didn't kill the woman" and "They didn't kill the woman also", namely, one of emphasis. "They killed the officer, but they didn't kill the woman" is a matter-of-fact statement. "They killed the officer, but they didn't kill the woman also" has the implication that "things could've been worse". </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I don't think there was anything wrong with the Klingon sentence and it could make sense in context.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div>-- <br class=""><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature">De'vID</div></div>
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