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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/16/2021 5:47 AM,
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:luis.chaparro@web.de">luis.chaparro@web.de</a> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:trinity-d847356e-0387-4ffd-9440-b145df6a7c65-1631785656618@3c-app-webde-bap49">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">As an aside: Maybe I'm wrong, but I've always thought of the way prefixes work with *-lu'* when there is an object as a funny way to reflect the typical transformations from active to passive, i.e., the object in active become the subject in passive and the subject in active become the agent in passive, so <b class="moz-txt-star"><span class="moz-txt-tag">*</span>One has eaten the cakes<span class="moz-txt-tag">*</span></b> (he / she - them) become <b class="moz-txt-star"><span class="moz-txt-tag">*</span>The cakes have been eaten by someone<span class="moz-txt-tag">*</span></b> (they - by him / her).</pre>
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<p>You definitely shouldn't think of the Klingon indefinite subject
as being related to any kind of passive voice. When you replace
the subject with <b>-lu'</b>, everything else about the clause
remains the same except for the prefix.<br>
</p>
<p><b>jIH mulegh ghaH</b><i> He sees me.</i></p>
<p><b>jIH vIleghlu'</b><i> Someone unspecified sees me. </i>(<b>jIH</b>
remains the object.)<br>
<i></i></p>
<p>It's only in the English translation does anything to do with
passive voice potentially appear.</p>
<p>We are told in TKD the reason the prefixes change with the
indefinite subject:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Since the subject is always the same (that is, it is always
unstated), the pronomial prefixes... are used in a different
way. Those prefixes which normally indicate first- or
second-person subject and third-person object... are used to
indicate first- or second-person object.</p>
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<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:trinity-d847356e-0387-4ffd-9440-b145df6a7c65-1631785656618@3c-app-webde-bap49">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">Just a short question: With no object *-lu'* takes always the prefix 0, right?</pre>
</blockquote>
<p>Yes. Example: <b>quSDaq ba'lu''a'</b><i> Is this seat taken?</i>
(Literally, <i>Does one sit in chair?</i>)<br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
SuStel
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://trimboli.name">http://trimboli.name</a></pre>
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