<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default"><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">Thanks all for your reply! (Hoch tujangta’mo’ qatlho’!)<span></span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">@<span></span></span></b><font face="times new roman, serif"><b>Quvar valer 'utlh</b></font></p>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><span style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><font color="#0000ff">Savan!</font></span></blockquote><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><font color="#0000ff">Your
message marked as KLBC is directed to one person only, so it may be more
correct to say {qavan}, but that's really nitpicking ;-)</font></span></blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">jIyaj, Dochmey mach jISaH je!<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><span> </span></span></p>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class="gmail_quote"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><font color="#0000ff">What I actually wanted to say is that you speak so
much Klingon already, that you are not a true "beginner".</font></span></blockquote><div><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">qatlho’ </span><span lang="EN-US"><font face="wingdings">:)</font></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"> ’ach Dochmey law’ tu’lu’ ’e’ wej vIghojta’.</span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><span> </span></span></p>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class="gmail_quote"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><font color="#0000ff">PS: if possible, deactivate autoformatting for
apostrophes.</font></span></blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">qaghwI' vIvevmo’, DaH <Alt + 0146> vIlo’
’e’ vIwaH.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><span> </span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">@Voragh:<span></span></span></b></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">qu’! pab lo’mey cho’aghta’mo’ qatlho’ </span><span lang="EN-US"><font face="wingdings">:)</font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><span> </span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">@’arHa:<span></span></span></b></p>
<blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex" class="gmail_quote"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><font color="#0000ff">“jaqbogh ’ach
maw’bogh ’ej wochbogh yaS Qup vIlegh.”<br></font></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><font color="#0000ff">I think
this is alright but why do it that way? -> Consider: {{yaS Qup vIlegh. jaq,
woch... 'ach maw'qu'!}}</font></span></blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">Yes it makes sense too. But in this case, wouldn’t it
shift the focus of the text? <span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">1/ “jaqbogh ’ach maw’bogh ’ej wochbogh yaS Qup vIlegh”<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">I feel that here the focus of the sentence is more on
the description of the officer that I’m seeing, with his 1<sup>st</sup> three
attributes <jaq>, <maw’>, <woch> on an equal footing, and
<Qup> being considered the most essential attribute, since it’s directly
added after <yaS>. <span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">We can show the highlight as below:<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><I see a <b><u>young</u>
officer</b>, (who is) tall, bold but crazy.><span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">The way I interpret things (and correct me if I’m
wrong) is that, in Klingon, if we put a normal adjective just after the noun,
then it would be considered as the noun’s main / defining attribute, and the
relative clauses would then describe secondary attributes.<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">Following this assumption, if we shuffle it around a
bit, we could insist more on the fact that the main attribute of the officer
is, for example, being “tall” instead of “young”:<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">“jaqbogh ’ach maw’bogh ’ej Qupbogh yaS woch vIlegh”<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><I see a <b><u>tall</u>
officer</b>, (who is) young, bold but crazy.><span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">or if we want to put absolutely all attributes on an
equal footing, then we use –bogh everywhere, so the main object of the
sentence is no longer a tall or young officer (who is bold but crazy…), but
just “an officer” (who is young, tall etc):<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">“Qupbogh ’ej wochbogh ’ej jaqbogh ’ach maw’bogh yaS
vIlegh”<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><I see a young, tall, bold but crazy <b>officer</b>.><span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><span> </span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">2/ yaS Qup
vIlegh. jaq, woch... </span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">'ach maw'qu'<span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">Here there are 2 statements so each statement
highlights a different focus point.<span></span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p>
<font face="times new roman, serif">- yaS Qup vIlegh : focus on “I see an officer” (the “core” part of the action, with no descriptive element)<br>- jaq, woch... 'ach maw'qu': the description of the officer that I see, with an emphasis on “… but he is really crazy”</font>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">So it seems to bring a different nuance from what I'd suggested. <span></span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><span> </span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">Sorry if I over-analyze it though! (I like to go into
the details, and this is also really important in translation) Let me know what
you think </span><span lang="EN-US"><font face="wingdings">:)</font></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US"><font face="wingdings"><br></font></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif">Also, next time, maybe it’s best if I don’t use the KLBC
anymore, so everyone is free to join the conversation directly if they want. <span></span></span></p><p class="MsoNormal" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-family:"times new roman",serif"><br></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><font face="times new roman, serif">~mughwI'</font></p></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">2016-09-30 0:35 GMT+02:00 John R. Harness <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cartweel@gmail.com" target="_blank">cartweel@gmail.com</a>></span>:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Hi all --<span class=""><br><br>Lieven:<br>"<span style="font-size:12.8px">And regarding your question, </span><span style="font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">you</span><span style="font-size:12.8px"> already answered it yourself - but I'll let the BG tell </span><span style="font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">you</span><span style="font-size:12.8px"> why."</span><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div></span><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">Actually I don't know why, other than that's how people do it. Maybe because it starts to produce parsing errors?</span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">mughwI':</font></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">“jaqbogh ‘ach maw’bogh ‘ej wochbogh yaS Qup vIlegh.”</span><span style="font-size:12.8px"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br></font></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br></span></div><div><span style="font-size:12.8px">I think this is alright but why do it that way? -> Consider: {{yaS Qup vIlegh. jaq, woch... 'ach maw'qu'!}}</span></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra">'arHa</div><div class="gmail_extra"><div><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><font color="#808080" face="Arial, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:10.6667px"><br>--<br><br><a href="http://www.socialistalternative.org/" target="_blank">Socialist Alternative</a></span></font><div><font color="#808080" face="Arial, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif"><span style="font-size:10.6667px"><a href="http://www.kli.org/" target="_blank">Klingon Language Institute</a></span></font></div></div></div></div></div></div><div><div class="h5">
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Sep 29, 2016 at 3:09 PM, Steven Boozer <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:sboozer@uchicago.edu" target="_blank">sboozer@uchicago.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Lieven:<br>
<span>> And regarding your question, you already answered it yourself - but I'll<br>
> let the BG tell you why.<br>
<br>
</span>Aurélie Demonchaux:<br>
<span>>> Is there a canon reference somewhere listing several adjectives<br>
>> linked to the same noun? As in:<br>
<br>
</span>While we're waiting for the BG here are the references you requested:<br>
<br>
romuluSngan Sambogh 'ej HoHbogh nejwI'<br>
Romulan hunter-killer probe (KCD)<br>
<br>
SuDbogh Dargh 'ej wovbogh<br>
The tea that is {SuD} and light. (KGT)<br>
(i.e. light green tea)<br>
<br>
Suto'vo'qor botlhDaq<br>
pe'vIl joqchu'taH<br>
quvbogh 'ej valbogh tIqDu' tIQ<br>
[translation unavailable] (PB)<br>
<br>
<br>
This last example is controversial so I wouldn't advise using it:<br>
<br>
yoHbogh matlhbogh je SuvwI'<br>
Say'moHchu' may' 'Iw<br>
The blood of battle washes clean<br>
the warrior brave and true. (Anthem)<br>
<br>
It's the only known example of the pattern {X-bogh Y-bogh je NOUN} -- possibly because it's a song lyric and the translation had to fit the meter.<br>
<br>
<br>
--<br>
Voragh<br>
tlhIngan ghantoH pIn'a'<br>
Ca'Non Master of the Klingons<br>
<div><div><br>
<br>
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