[tlhIngan Hol] perfective {-pu'} using/combining aspect with aspect

[mayqel qunen'oS]

This was going to be a thread where I would ask for clarification on
something I didn't understand. Luckily though, SuStel already clarified
this matter on the following thread:

perfective {-pu'} using/combining aspect with no aspect
http://lists.kli.org/pipermail/tlhingan-hol-kli.org/2022-April/019663.html

But I'll proceed by writing some thoughts on this thread, more as note to
my future self, explaining to him what it was that made me/him/us confused
about this matter.

So..

The whole confusion started when I wanted to write: "the inhabitants had
started from the earliest times consulting the oracle". After some thought,
I decided translating this sentence as "the inhabitants had started
obtaining the advice of the oracle, when the the early eras had become to
happen". So I wrote:

Qun 'otHa'wI' qeS luSuqchoHpu' ngan, qaSchoHpu'DI' bovmey 'eq

But the problem now was the following.. Suppose I put the second part of
that sentence first:

qaSchoHpu'DI' bovmey 'eq, Qun 'otHa'wI' qeS luSuqchoHpu' ngan

This sentence now gave me the impression that "when the early eras have
begun to happen, the inhabitants had begun obtaining the advice of the
oracle", meaning that their starting to obtain the advice, had preceded the
commencement of the early eras.

This confusion continued until SuStel wrote in the aforementioned thread:

********** quote starts **********

SuStel:

Saying wa'Hu' jIXpu' doesn't mean "as of yesterday I have already done X."
It means "yesterday, I performed a completed action X." "Completed" doesn't
mean action X was a fulfillment of a goal; it's just a way of looking at
action X from afar, without internal parts.

********** quote ends **********

Of course, SuStel doesn't talk about a {-XchoHpu'DI', -YchoHpu'} case, but
I think that whatever goes for the {wa'Hu' jIXpu'} goes as well for the
{-XchoHpu'DI', -YchoHpu'}. Instead of a "yesterday" when the performing of
a completed action occured, we now have a {-choH} which is {-pu'}ed when/as
soon as a {-choHpu'} happens.

So all is good.

But unfortunately, I still had the problem already described, whenever I
read the {qaSchoHpu'DI' bovmey 'eq, Qun 'otHa'wI' qeS luSuqchoHpu' ngan}
"when the early eras have begun to happen, the inhabitants had begun
obtaining the advice of the oracle". And I couldn't understand why I was
having this problem.

Until I realized what was happening (or at least I think I did..)

My confusion started from reading the {qaSchoHpu'DI' bovmey 'eq, Qun
'otHa'wI' qeS luSuqchoHpu' ngan} as "when the early eras have begun to
happen, the inhabitants had begun obtaining the advice of the oracle", and
then translating the English sentence to Greek.

If however I read the Klingon as "as soon as the early eras have begun to
happen, the inhabitants have begun obtaining the advice of the oracle"
(i.e. instead of a "when" I used "as soon as" and instead of a "had" I used
a "have"), then neither the English nor the Greek equivalent would sound
strange. All I had to do would be perform these tweaks, and voila! Bob's
your uncle (as this obscure English idiom/proverb/saying whatever the hell
it is, would say..)

So finally the confusion went away and everything became right as rain.

-- 
Dana'an
https://sacredtextsinklingon.wordpress.com/
Ζεὺς ἦν, Ζεὺς ἐστίν, Ζεὺς ἔσσεται· ὦ μεγάλε Ζεῦ
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