[tlhIngan Hol] perfective {-pu'} using/combining aspect with no aspect

SuStel sustel at trimboli.name
Thu Apr 7 06:51:32 PDT 2022

On 4/7/2022 9:18 AM, Iikka Hauhio wrote:
> Dana'an:
>     Suppose I say: {wa'Hu' jIghungDI', pItSa' vIvunpu'}, for
>     "yesterday, as soon as I was hungry, I ordered a pizza".
>     I'm asking this because I understand the klingon as "yesterday, as
>     soon as I'm hungry, I have ordered a pizza", meaning that I "feel"
>     it very close to "yesterday, as soon as I'm hungry, I've (already)
>     ordered a pizza".
>> Perhaps you could say
> *wa'Hu' jIghungchoHDI', wejHa' pItSa' vIvunpu'.*
> *
> *
> to make clear that you have ordered the pizza as of becoming hungry.

Yes, the issue here is that *-DI'* on verbs expressing qualities often 
makes little sense, because "as soon as" implies that something happens 
/as soon as/ the expressed change occurs. *jIghungDI'* doesn't express a 
change of state; it only expresses a state, so there's nothing "as soon 
as" about it. *jIghungchoHDI'* solves this problem.

A brief glance through canon doesn't bring any quality verbs with *-DI'* 
to my attention, with one exception that doesn't really count. 
(/paq'batlh/ has *rInDI'*/as soon as it is finished,/ but the verb *rIn* 
itself already implies a change of state to a completion, so it's not a 
good example.) One wonders if /Q/*-DI'* is another semantically 
non-sensible combination in Klingon.

The other issue here is that *-DI'* doesn't mean "as soon as the action 
expressed is finished." *vIHoHDI'* doesn't mean that something happens 
as soon as he is dead; it means, basically, /at the same moment that I 
kill him./ If you want to describe something that occurs upon the 
completion of the killing, rather than simultaneously with the killing, 
you'd need to say *vIHoHpu'DI'.*

So for instance:

*jaghwI' vIHoHDI', qabDajDaq jItuy'.*/When I kill my enemy, I spit on 
his face./
*jaghwI' vIHoHpu'DI', tajwIj vISay'moH.*/When I have killed my enemy, I 
clean my knife./

In the first sentence, I stab my enemy and, as he stares at me with 
bulging eyes, I spit on his face. In the second sentence, I stab my 
enemy, then he drops to the ground and dies, and then I clean my knife.

So if we have *wa'Hu' jIghungchoHDI', pItSa' vIvunpu',* we're saying 
that at the moment yesterday that I went from not hungry to hungry, I 
ordered a pizza. Again, "moment" in this context doesn't necessarily 
mean "instant"; these two events just happen approximately 
simultaneously from a human, rather than a precise, perspective. *-DI'* 
doesn't imply precise simultaneity, just a reasonable approximation. 
Hey, my stomach is starting to rumble. Hand me the phone.

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