[tlhIngan Hol] vIta'pu'be' vs vIta'be'pu'

[Steven Boozer]

nI'ghma wrote:
> My problem with this matter has to do, with the way I understand the {vIta'pu'be'} and
> the {vIta'be'pu'}, if I "read" the {-be'} as if referring only to whatever directly precedes it.  
> I read the {vIta'pu'be'} as "it isn't completed the whatever it is that I did".  
> And I read the {vIta'be'pu'} as "it is completed my not doing it".  Lets write an example.

Let's look at how Okrand has used {-be'} with  {-pu'} on the same verb.  AFAIK there no examples of {-be'pu'}, one example of {-pu'be'} :

   pa' jIHpu'be' 
   I wasn't there. TKD

and one example of {-be'lu'pu'}:

   'entepray' Hub patmey luchu'be'lu'pu' 
   Enterprise defense systems are down. (ST5 notes)

There is only a single example of {-be'} used with {-ta'} on the same verb:

   loDnI'wI' bIHoHta'be' 
   My brother, you failed to kill (PB) 

These results surprised me.  I'd have expected more examples of negative perfect verbs.

>  {QIn tetlhvam vImuvpu'be'}
>  I joined this list, but my joining isn't completed

Then you didn't actually join the list.  You tried {nID} to join the list, or you're in the process of joining the list (e.g. waiting for the administrator's approval) -- so why not use {-lI'} (in progress): {QIn tetlhvam vImuvlI'} -- or you decided {wuq} not to join the list after all.

>  {QIn tetlhvam vImuvbe'pu'}
>  I didn't join this list, and this (my not joining) is completed.

I have no idea what this "translation" is supposed to mean.  Do you mean that you failed to join the list (e.g. you tried repeatedly but the sign-up subroutine isn't working)?  

Perhaps if you provide a little context for each example I'd have a better idea of what you're asking.

--
Voragh