[tlhIngan Hol] At the qepHom ask about the vonlu'

[mayqel qunenoS]

kgt:
> The slang expression is used in such constructions
> as *bIvonlu'pu' *("You have failed completely"; literally, "You
> have been trapped").

Here is the problem; why {bIvonlu'pu'} and not {Davonlu'pu'} ?

~ nIghma'

On Oct 27, 2017 7:05 PM, "Steven Boozer" <sboozer at uchicago.edu> wrote:

> (KGT 165-66):  The verb *von*, usually translated as * trap, entrap*,
> means "put (someone) in a position from which there is no escape." For a
> Klingon, to be in such a position, to be unable to fight back, is most
> dishonorable, especially since he or she is likely to be viewed in a
> helpless state. Thus, it is a sign of utter failure. […] The slang
> expression is used in such constructions as *bIvonlu'pu' *("You have
> failed completely"; literally, "You have been trapped"). In standard
> Klingon, the same idea may be expressed by saying *lujbej *(*certainly
> fail*), *lujchu' *(*fail perfectly*), or *lujqu' *(*really fail*), all
> based on *luj *(*fail*). Note that *luj *is also used to mean *lose* (as
> in "lose at a game"). To say "I lose" is *jIluj*; to say "I lose in a big
> way" is *jIlujqu' *or *jIlujchu'*. The slang term *vonlu' *is not used in
> reference to games. It means "perform most inadequately, ineffectually,
> unsuccessfully" and is applied to one's performance as a warrior,
> tactician, political usurper, and the like.
>
> --Voragh
>
>
>
> *From:* mayqel qunenoS
>
> Another thing which perhaps needs clarification is the vonlu'.
>
>
>
> A little bird told me, that at the kgt it is written {bIvonlu'pu'} instead
> of {Davonlu'pu'}.
>
>
>
> So, this raises the question, whether the {-lu'} shoved up the {von} of
> {vonlu'} is the indefinite subject suffix which we all know and love, or
> whether it is just a {lu'} which happened to cross the street while this
> word was being created.
>
>
>
> So, could someone write {vonlu'lu'} for "someone has failed utterly " ?
>
>
>
> And if it is indeed the indefinite subject suffix {-lu'}, then for
> "someone again failed utterly", do we write {vonqa'lu'} or {vonlu'qa'} ?
> Because if we write {vonqa'lu'} how would someone be able to differentiate
> from the {vonqa'lu'} which would mean "someone trapped him/them again" ?
>
>
>
> I'm tired of having to "throw the cards" (greek expression meaning "trying
> to guess"), in order to clarify grammar which should have been already
> clarified at numerous qep'a'mey and qepHommey so far (as is the case with
> {ngIq}, the verb prefix after a {joq}, etc etc etc..).
>
>
>
> ~ nIghma'
>
> _______________________________________________
> tlhIngan-Hol mailing list
> tlhIngan-Hol at lists.kli.org
> http://lists.kli.org/listinfo.cgi/tlhingan-hol-kli.org
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.kli.org/pipermail/tlhingan-hol-kli.org/attachments/20171027/990344e7/attachment.htm>