[tlhIngan Hol] Vanitas Vanitatum et Omnia Vanitas

nIqolay Q niqolay0 at gmail.com
Mon Oct 10 12:44:14 PDT 2016

On Mon, Oct 10, 2016 at 4:36 AM, De'vID <de.vid.jonpin at gmail.com> wrote:

> On 8 October 2016 at 09:12, mayqel qunenoS <mihkoun at gmail.com> wrote:
> > ghunchu'wI'
> >> Do you understand the sentence you quoted?
> >> Do you know what "time period" means
> >
> > What I do understand, is that numerous times on this list the {'op ret}
> has
> > been used without anyone objecting.
> I think this may be just an issue of something that is slightly odd,
> but is just understandable enough that most people feel it's not worth
> pointing out. {'op ret} without a unit of time is like saying "some
> ago" in English. Really, if you mean "one day in the past", it ought
> to be {'op Hu'}.

I would argue that {'op ret} without a unit of time is like saying "at some
time in the past" in English, since that's what's provided as the
translation for {'op ret} without a unit of time in the qep'a' materials.
Was there some other information provided at the qep'a' but not shared
online that would suggest that MO meant this to be a shorthand notation for
general {'op X} time phrases, and not a phrase in its own right? Based on
the way the handout is phrased and presented, it seemed pretty clear to me
that {'op ret} and {'op pIq} are acceptable phrases for describing
unspecified times in the past or future.

I know that {ret} and {pIq} usually require a time period noun, and if you
want to emphasize that the time in the past is measured in, say, weeks ago
rather than days ago or centuries ago, I think you should use {'op Hogh
ret}. But if you're not specifying a time frame, and just referring to any
time in the past, why does it matter whether there's a unit? {'op ret}
would just literally mean "some unspecified amount of unspecified time
periods ago". Admittedly, this particular expression probably doesn't see
much everyday use, given the Klingon cultural reluctance to be imprecise,
but I don't see why that would make {'op ret} any more ungrammatical than,
say, {jIHeghvIp}.
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