[tlhIngan Hol] Disturbing irregularities

mayqel qunenoS mihkoun at gmail.com
Wed Jun 22 07:26:44 PDT 2016

ok, I think I understand..

so, if I want to ask "who are you", then both {SoH 'Iv}, and {'Iv SoH}
are the same, right ?

and if I want to ask 'what is this", then both {'oH nuq}, and {nuq
'oH} are the same right ?

On Wed, Jun 22, 2016 at 4:43 PM, SuStel <sustel at trimboli.name> wrote:
> On 6/22/2016 9:18 AM, mayqel qunenoS wrote:
> De'vID:
> Saying {jIH mayqel} is like saying "Me Tarzan".
> It'll be understood, but it's not grammatical.
> thank you for replying ; however what you wrote, contradicts SuStel's
> input which is the following :
> SuStel :
> A Klingon to-be sentence expresses the idea X = Y. 'elaDya'ngan jIH
> me = Greek; mayqel jIH me = Michael. There is no a, an, or the in Klingon."
> if X=Y, then Y=X right ?
> I did not intend to suggest that Klingon grammar can be manipulated by the
> rules of mathematics.
> furthermore, SuStel wrote..
> SuStel :
> You should more or less ignore the ideas of subject and object with regard
> to to-be sentences.
> I can understand ignoring the ideas of subject and object with regard
> to to-be sentences ; but how placing the {mayqel} after the {jIH} is
> able to produce "me michael" ? Since in to-be sentences X=Y and vice
> versa, if {jIH mayqel} produces "me michael", then {mayqel jIH} must
> produce the same result too. right ?
> I don't quite agree with De'vID's analogy of me Tarzan. Klingon's normal
> mode of to-be sentences are like me Tarzan. tlhIngan jIH is the equivalent
> of saying me Klingon. The only difference is that the Klingon pronoun can
> take suffixes for added meaning. Saying SuStel 'oH pongwIj'e' is the
> equivalent of saying SuStel me name.
> Notice that I say equivalent. Do not try to copy the grammar of me Tarzan
> into Klingon. It is only an illustration. Klingon's to-be sentence rules
> must simply be learned. They are what they are because they simply are.
> When associating a noun with a pronoun, the noun comes first. It doesn't
> matter whether the noun is a common noun or a proper noun. Human jIH. SuStel
> jIH.
> When linking two nouns together, one noun is the "topic" or "subject" noun.
> This is the noun you're "starting" with. The other noun is the noun being
> introduced later. Human ghaH SuStel'e' as for SuStel, he is a human. Here,
> SuStel is the topic or subject; Human is the noun being introduced to
> associate with him. yaHDajDaq ghaHtaH SuStel'e' as for SuStel, he is at his
> duty station. SuStel is the topic or subject; yaHDajDaq is being used to
> associate with him.
> SoH 'Iv and 'Iv SoH appear in both forms because (a) Okrand probably forgot
> he did it one way, and (b) 'Iv is a kind of pronoun too, so either word can
> satisfy the pronoun part of a to-be sentence.
> --
> SuStel
> http://trimboli.name
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