[tlhIngan Hol] Who shall call them from the twilight ?

[Steven Boozer]

SuStel is using the method for translating "which/what is X?" that Okrand introduced on the old msn.onstage.startrek.expert.okrand  BBS.  FYI here is the relevant part of his post (unformatted):


************************************************************************



From: MarcOkrand  <...>

Newsgroups: msn.onstage.startrek.expert.okrand

Date: December 12, 1996

Subject: What do you think?



   [. . . .]



(2) You suggested translating "What is your favorite month?" as:



    jarlIj qaq nuq?



This one's a little easier to deal with.  Your sentence literally means

"What is your preferable month?"  The basic syntax is correct.  Question

words (in this case, nuq "what?") function the same way pronouns do in

questions with "to be" in the English translations.  Thus, the question

yIH nuq? "What is a tribble?" is exactly parallel the statement yIH 'oH

"It is a tribble" (where yIH is "tribble" and 'oH is "it").  The answer to the question yIH nuq? ("What is a tribble?") would presumably be a

definition or description of a tribble.  This being the case, then, the

answer to the question jarlIj qaq nuq?  ("What is your preferable month?") would presumably be a definition of "your favorite month." But this is not what you want to find out by asking your question.  What you really mean to ask is something like "Of all the months, which one do you prefer?"



The first word in your sentence, jarlIj, means "your month" (jar "month," -lIj "your").  But given that what you're really asking is "Which month do you prefer?" it's not really "your month" at all.  The "you" should go with the verb, not with "month."



Which brings us to the verb.  You use qaq, "be preferable," adjectivally

(jarlIj qaq is "your preferable month").  I think what you mean is better

expressed by using the verb maS "prefer" with "you" as the subject: jar

DamaS "you prefer the month."  If you want to highlight the notion of

"most prefer," you can use the emphatic suffix -qu': jar DamaSqu' "you

very much prefer the month."  (In this case, since "prefer" involves

making a choice, the one chosen is automatically the one that is "most"

preferred.)



So what about the "what" (or "which") of your original question

("What/which is your favorite month?")?  When asking someone a question of

this type, you are really asking him or her to make a choice.  So just be

a Klingon and order them to do so: "Identify the month that you very much prefer!":



    jar DamaSqu'bogh yIngu'



DamaSqu'bogh "that you very much prefer" (DamaSqu' "you very much prefer

it" plus -bogh "which," the relative-clause marker) modifies jar "month"

and the whole phrase jar DamaSqu'bogh "the month that you very much

prefer" is the object of the verb ngu' ("identify"), which is preceded by the imperative prefix yI- ("do something to it!").



Given that there's an awful lot about Klingon grammar that's not yet known, you did a good job coming up with the translations you came up with.  I hope my explanations and clarifications make sense.



************************************************************************


On Behalf Of SuStel
Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2016 10:47 AM


On 12/14/2016 11:17 AM, mayqel qunenoS wrote:

I'm just asking in order to make sure I understand this correctly.

lets say I want to ask "which ship arrived ?". both {paw'ta' Duj nuq} and {paw'ta' nuq Duj} are wrong, right ?

paw, not paw' (unless the arrival was very rough!).

nuq goes into the place of the answer. If the answer isn't the same sentence with a substitution for nuq, then the question is not formed correctly.

If the answer to the question is, for instance, that the Enterprise arrived, then the answer is pawta' 'entepray'. But this isn't in the same form that you asked it, because it doesn't include the word Duj. So the entire method of asking the question is doubtful.

There are some answers that would fit, like, say, pawta' DIvI' Duj. But not every answer will fit, so you may not be able to ask questions this way.

In any case, we've never seen Okrand use nuq or 'Iv in a noun-noun construction like this, so whether or not this is allowed is unknown.

The most common thing to do is turn it into a command to identify: paw'ta'bogh Duj yIngu' identify the ship that has arrived! If you're not asking for a name, you might get more specific, like pawta'bogh Duj Sar yIngu' identify the type of ship that has arrived!

--

SuStel

http://trimboli.name
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.kli.org/pipermail/tlhingan-hol-kli.org/attachments/20161214/c37e9eb1/attachment-0016.htm>